Fingerprinting Technology Using fingerprints as credit cards

[ASR1405241491 0]

I've been wondering when we are going to see the little consumer fingerprint pads hooked up to cash registers all over the country in all types of stores...grocery stores....clothing stores.....gas stations...Instead of using the swipe pads or machines for our credit cards, why can't we just use our fingerprints instead? ... In a time of so much identity theft and fraud, wouldn't buying goods or services with just your fingerprint, be the better way and more secure way to go?I remember bringing up this topic with an actor friend of mine last year, and right after I told her about it, she had a commercial audition for a company that basically sells this type of technology. I never found out if she got the commercial job or not, but I'm just waiting patiently for the day that we can say goodbye to our credit card clutter...Any thoughts on whether this would be a good thing or not?

[evion 0]

Fingerprinting technology has been around for a long time now and even with their 1 in 500 billion chances of having the same print between two persons (just a guess ), they're still not being substituted for credit cards and other security identificational needs. Problem is, most people nowadays own a credit card. Even rural farmers own them sometimes, but they don't quite understand how it works, they just know that they can use it to charge for their buying needs.If we start using fingerprinting technology, everyone around the world will have to apply for a super accurate fingerprint scan that will possibly stay in the computer files of each country forever. It's a little tricky though, determining 2-3 fingerprints within family members to be able to get into a room of a house is pretty simple to do. But a computer would not be able to take billions of fingerprints and find one, it's either impossible or it will take a very long time. Man still needs to work on our capabilities in the developmend of computers and only after we develop such a super computer, shall we begin the new age of fingerprint technology on every doorstep, every grocery store, every airport, and possibly - every library book to be checked out of the library.

[szupie 0]

Well, this would be a good thing, but the reason they are not doing this, I think, is that it is too expensive. Even if it is only more costly by a few dollars, the stores will not replace all of their machines with fingerprint pads. If some major credit card company decides to start using fingerprint technology, and sponsors another major store to buy fingerprint pads, then we might get to use the technology.But I think there's a problem with fingerprints: If you get burnt or get a huge cut on your finger, wouldn't it affect the print? What if your entire thumb got chopped off? They should use both signing and fingerprint-ing machines to avoid problems.

[vizskywalker 0]

What if your entire thumb got chopped off? They should use both signing and fingerprint-ing machines to avoid problems.

I think that having your thumb cut off would affect your signature as well. But despite what governemtns and law enforcement agencies claim, fingerprints, like DNA, can be very similar between family members, and can change like szupie pointed out over the course of a lifetime. Pattern matching also makes determining which fingerprint is the proper one take a long time. The FBI uses large networks of computers to find one fingerprint out of 300 million, much less the several billion people with credit cards. And it still takes them many hours (unlike what is shown in TV and movies). Also, fingerprint scanners are really not accurate enough in cheap enough models to be feasible in stores, whereas credit card swipers can frequently only cost around $20 for a cheap one, with the subscription to the companies validation service being the expensive part.
~Viz

[pomjim 0]

Here in Australia one of the big banks is looking very closely at fingerprint technology for it's ATMs. I think that it could work, mainly because the only fingerprints it would need on it's data base would be it's own customers, and storing a couple opf million prints shouldn't be that difficult. (at least I wouldn't have thought so)What with FP technology, biometric passports and suchlike, in a few years we'll all be embedded with a bar code at birth and that will be that, instant ID!!!

[Sarah81 0]

It's a great concept in theory. I wouldn't mind being able to run my thumb across the display instead of dragging out my debit card. Then again, I can't think of anybody who would actually *want* to steal my identity (bad credit, no money in the bank to steal, and a massive pile of student-loan debts). Hehe. I actually feel a little sorry for anyone who would be stupid enough to try and be me for a while.

[jcguy 0]

I think the major concern here before finger printing technology becomes a mainstream technology is security and privacy. The ststem has to be totally fool-proof and hacker-proof so that shoppers and consumers can all use the system without worrying about their fingerprints and data being compromised. Identity theft has to be totally prevented.

[yungblood 0]

Personally, I think fingerprints are a great backup means of identification, but not as a means of primary identification. Aside from the fact that scaners have varing degress of sensitivity, and that it would take a long time to sort all the fingerprints, just think of all the fingerprints we leave everywhere.Back when I was in grade school, my parents got me a "DetectoLab" kit. It included the basic scientific equipment needed for detective stuff, along with a fingerprinting kit. It gave me enough stuff I could easily find usable prints of a decent quality. They expected you to dust black (or white) powder over where you thought there were prints. Any prints there would show up, and if you wanted to keep a copy of a print, you could use scotch tape to save it. Yea, it worked ok, though I found taking a picture of the print to preserve it better.As I have mentioned in other posts, I am a hacker, so it is normal for me to think in terms of security. The reason we have so many criminals out there, is because it's so easy to get away with most types of crime. We just don't have a big enough police force, or an effecient enough court system. As most people can imagine, counterfieters spend a sizeable amount of money on thier money/check printing machines. For only a few thousand dollars, I could get the machines needed do duplicate fingerprints. And it would get past almost all fingerprint scanners. Since I'm sure I'm not the first person to use this idea (there are even variations in movies of this idea), let me lay it out.1: using a superfine powder, dust for fingerprints in comman areas used by the public.2: once you find clear fingerprints, take a closeup picture of them with a hi res digital camera.3: using a "3D printer", print the fingerprint on a thin plastic/rubber (or simular material) film.4: cutout the print, and apply to your finger.5: use print on a scanner.6: Instant Access.Since most people aren't familiar with 3D printers, let me describe them. First, think of an inkjet printer. It's print heads sweep back and forth printing a page in narrow bands. The rollers in the printer hold the page steady, and ensure that it advances just enough of the page to have each band of printing aline with the previous. With a 3D printer, it holds the "page" immobile, and the print heads not only sweep back & forth, but the whole track moves up & down the "page". 3D printers don't use ink, they print with other materials. Some use clay/wax. Others can use plastics, cement, metal, and other more advanced materials. The print heads build up the 3D object by printing each layer one on top of the next, until you have a complete object. 3D printers are slowly making thier way to the public, especially for people into modeling, and people that want to make molds from CAD type computer files.As you can see, it really wouldn't take that much to copy peoples fingerprints, considering how much we leave fingerprints everywhere.Me, I would have the fingerprint data of all a person's fingers saved when you get a credit card. So that you would use your fingerprint to verify that the card is yours, instead of a signiture. But even that leaves the biggest problem with identity theft, using a credit card remotely, either over the phone, or the internet.To me, it would be much wiser to figure out a way to get around that problem. I have a few ideas, but they would take more time than I have right now to describe them.Anyways, to sum up, we leave too many fingerprints behind everywhere to use them to protect our money. (Unless everyone always wore gloves...)-YB

[sm0k3ymcl3ud 0]

Personally, I think fingerprints are a great backup means of identification, but not as a means of primary identification.  Aside from the fact that scaners have varing degress of sensitivity, and that it would take a long time to sort all the fingerprints, just think of all the fingerprints we leave everywhere.

 

Back when I was in grade school, my parents got me a "DetectoLab" kit.  It included the basic scientific equipment needed for detective stuff, along with a fingerprinting kit.  It gave me enough stuff I could easily find usable prints of a decent quality.  They expected you to dust black (or white) powder over where you thought there were prints.  Any prints there would show up, and if you wanted to keep a copy of a print, you could use scotch tape to save it.  Yea, it worked ok, though I found taking a picture of the print to preserve it better.

 

As I have mentioned in other posts, I am a hacker, so it is normal for me to think in terms of security.  The reason we have so many criminals out there, is because it's so easy to get away with most types of crime.  We just don't have a big enough police force, or an effecient enough court system.  As most people can imagine, counterfieters spend a sizeable amount of money on thier money/check printing machines.  For only a few thousand dollars, I could get the machines needed do duplicate fingerprints.  And it would get past almost all fingerprint scanners.  Since I'm sure I'm not the first person to use this idea (there are even variations in movies of this idea), let me lay it out.

 

1: using a superfine powder, dust for fingerprints in comman areas used by the public.

2: once you find clear fingerprints, take a closeup picture of them with a hi res digital camera.

3: using a "3D printer", print the fingerprint on a thin plastic/rubber (or simular material) film.

4: cutout the print, and apply to your finger.

5: use print on a scanner.

6: Instant Access.

 

Since most people aren't familiar with 3D printers, let me describe them.  First, think of an inkjet printer.  It's print heads sweep back and forth printing a page in narrow bands.  The rollers in the printer hold the page steady, and ensure that it advances just enough of the page to have each band of printing aline with the previous.  With a 3D printer, it holds the "page" immobile, and the print heads not only sweep back & forth, but the whole track moves up & down the "page".  3D printers don't use ink, they print with other materials.  Some use clay/wax.  Others can use plastics, cement, metal, and other more advanced materials.  The print heads build up the 3D object by printing each layer one on top of the next, until you have a complete object.  3D printers are slowly making thier way to the public, especially for people into modeling, and people that want to make molds from CAD type computer files.

 

As you can see, it really wouldn't take that much to copy peoples fingerprints, considering how much we leave fingerprints everywhere.

 

Me, I would have the fingerprint data of all a person's fingers saved when you get a credit card.  So that you would use your fingerprint to verify that the card is yours, instead of a signiture.  But even that leaves the biggest problem with identity theft, using a credit card remotely, either over the phone, or the internet.

 

To me, it would be much wiser to figure out a way to get around that problem.  I have a few ideas, but they would take more time than I have right now to describe them.

 

Anyways, to sum up, we leave too many fingerprints behind everywhere to use them to protect our money.  (Unless everyone always wore gloves...)

 

-YB

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It's not even that hard to fake a fingerprint on some of todays scanners, I know of one scanner that all you have to do is breathe on it to make the last person's fingerprint show up on the glass and the computer will see it, instant access. They havent gotten to the computer speed bridge yet, they are still trying to cross the anti-spoofing bridge, lol.

 

 

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Sm0k3y Mcl3uD

[Shadow X 0]

That is true that people can easily forge or try to find out another's fingerprint. If you've seen the film National Treasure, it was really easy for Ben to take the fingerprint of that blonde woman. But yes I agree, if that bridge could be crossed then security in the world, especially here in England, would be alot more tight and it will safer to protect your belongings. I really hope it comes out and it's successful.

[DigitalDingo 0]

I fully agree with many people here.

My first thought when I heard about this sort of technology was that – in my point of view – would be extremely easy to copy. Think about the police investigating a murder for example. All the police have to do is to find some fingerprints and then find the suspect. If the fingerprints match the suspect’s the case is almost closed.

It is so easy to find a good fingerprint. Also think about this: you are in a shop and you accidentally touch a surface made of glass for instance. Somebody, maybe the owner, could later find this fingerprint, copy it and then all he has to do is to try to get access to every bank in the town. Eventually he’ll find your bank and be able to steal your money.

Also somebody has mentioned that it would give some problems if your finger got wounded one way or another. It would probably mean that you should get a new “credit card” i.e. get your new fingerprint scanned into the system. And before you could do that, you would have to prove that it really is you. In my opinion: a lot of trouble.

 

Now I a better technology probably would be scanning of the eyes. Again you’ll have the same problem if your eye got damaged. But it would be more secure, because it is so much more difficult to copy an eye than copying a fingerprint.

[andrwxsCOL 0]

Well I think that the banks, have to have more security, in my personal opinion the use of the fingerprint is good, but most be combined with the normal credit card and a password to acces. Hibyring this two kind of security, I think that it will be more easy have security for the banks and the clients.And in a close future I except that the people use chips or something like that to acces very fast to all the information that they want. But we have te be carefull with all the implication that this brings to us, and the change in the all world

[ASR1405241491 0]

Wow, I thoroughly enjoyed reading everyone's response on FP technology! As the one Hacker (YB) pointed out, security is of the utmost importance. I'm concerned about security since I have been a victim of Identity Theft myself. It was very strange how it all happened. My credit card that was stolen was one I never used. It was filed away in my house for the sole purpose of being the overdraft protection on my checking account. So I kept asking myself, "how can my credit card number be stolen if I have never used it ever for any purchases ever?" ... well...I figured it was an "Inside Job." I assumed it was a bank employee turned "Hacker" (no offense YB), and they sold my number all over the US. But I think any Hacker could get into a bank system and steal credit card numbers. I just thought it was strange since I never used that card ever. Of course, my other credit cards I use frivolously day to day, I've never had a problem with...Well, as Pomjin noted, maybe we'll all be embedded with a barcode soon. Hell, they do it to our pets now, and even children, right? So, we'll never have to worry about the FingerPrinting technology.Enjoy your day all.

[yungblood 0]

Eye prints are much more secure than fingerprints, but that's not where we need to get better security. We need access to our accounts remotely in a secure way. Personally, I think it should be done in a "handshake" procedure. The merchant sends a request to your bank/credit company for the amount, then you have to contact your bank/credit company and explicitly tell them that you accept the transaction. To me, that would be so much harder to break, because the security wouldn't go through the merchants at all, it would be strictly between you & the bank/credit company.But as long as people want easy access to thier money, they won't have the security they want.-YB(PS) Any banker that would turn around and sell credit card info wouldn't be classified as a hacker, they have easy access to that info. That's more like embezzlement.

[saxsux 0]

Eye prints are much more secure than fingerprints

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But can't eyeprint scanners easily be fooled by people wearing special contact lenses?

 

I think the method you suggested is too long, and would be quie inconvenient for the consumer.