Child Abuse? Is slapping your 17yr old accross the face child abuse?

[krazygoddess 0]

Ok where to start is has been a while since I have posted been going through alot and yesterday it all got worse. Ok I have 4 kids 18,17,6 and 5. Three girls and one boy the boy is 6. My 17 yr old has always been my problem child she has major attitude and treats me very badly, I have put up with it for a long time and yesterday I just snapped. I was trying to talk to her yesterday and it became a argument like it usually does. She was yelling at me and screaming everyother word was f*** this and f*** that and you are a b**** and so on. A friend of mine was over and walked in from the other room and told her dont you talk to your mother like that, And then she started in on her f*** you and mind your own business and so on it got bad I stood up and walked over to her sitting on the couch to slap her in the face and before I touched her she kicked me so hard in the stomach I almost went backwards over the coffee table. Well that was it for me I jumped on her and turned her sideways and spanked her behind, and slapped her in the face. she got mad we argued some more and she left. She went down the street to a neighbors house and told them that I and my friend had beat the S*** out of her with our fists. I couldnt believe it. I drove down to the park to try to talk to her and she walked up to my window and started screaming at me again. I slapped her again in the face and left. I came home and about 20 minutes later the police were here. I told him everything exactly what happened and he said it doesnt look good for me because of the welt on her face. I am still in shock here. for one I cant believe I snapped like that I have never EVER hit any of my kids. But she has had this comeing for a long time and I couldnt take it anymore. But now Im in big trouble with alot of reprocussions. My daughter has always been full of lies she tells alot of stories and I dont know what she has told the police, but they have taken her away from me over this. She is not aloud back here and is going to be put in foster care and I am left with a mess of police and children services. Again, I have never hit any of my kids and I cant believe this is happening. I am so upset with myself for snapping like I did, I know I should have not hit her. But I cant believe all I am going to have to go through to get past this and I cant believe that they took her from me for smacking her, And now I risk loosing my little ones I will be watched and critisized on everything I do with my children now. I guess I am just sort of venting here so I will stop now before I ramble on and make no sense. I made this topic a poll because I want and need different opinions. please be honest. Did I commit child abuse? Is there such a thing as a child that needs to be smacked? Is there anyone out there with some similiar experinece that can offer me some advice? please HELP if there is. Thanks Krazy.

[shadowx 0]

I dont think you are guilty of anything here, i agree that you shouldnt have snapped, but that isnt the point. As you say she deserved punishment.My advice is to work very closely with the police. dont hide anything or be reluctant to answer their questions. Keep your calm and stay relaxed when they are around. you have your friend as a witness that you didnt beat the crap out of her. I think he likely outcome of this will be social services making a few house calls and asking you and the kids questions. If the problem child says youve been abusing them etc... im sure the other children wont do the same and lie so it should all be fine.For a long term solution you need to talk to the 17 year old and find out why she is like this. Many factors could be causing it and one of them could be jealousy of the other kids. I would presume that the younger kids get more attention (this isnt a bad thing, being younger they need more care and supervision) and the 17 year old could be jealous of that. If i were you i would find a room alone, perhaps her room or the living room when everyone else is out or busy and say to her you want to talk to her and find out whats wrong. she can tell you or ask you anything and you will answer honestly and listen to what she has to say. Then answer her questions and at any point if she becomes aggressive, loud, excessive swearing (i for one swear a lot, but not in anger, its just where ive been brought up swearing in these areas is pretty common!) then just say calmly and without raising your voice that you will talk to her later and just walk off, go make a drink and sit in another room or something. Eventually i think she will like the attention she is getting and calm down, then you will be able to find out the problems she is facing and hopefully resolve the situation.Good luck, hold it together!

[krazygoddess 0]

Shadow, Thank you very much for your reply, and I would love to sit down and talk to her but I cannot, she is not aloud her and the state has her she is in foster care now and they wont let me see her. I will find out more tomarrow when the police and children services are here. But again Thank-You very much for your reply.

[shadowx 0]

well as i said, i fully expect she will be returned to you in which case you can talk to her about this. Untill then keep your cool, the worst thing you could do is to become irate when the police or social services are around. If they see you getting angry easily then its fuel for their imaginary fire. Best of luck

[Saint_Michael 3]

**Big giant hugs***

 

I can only imagine how hard it is for you right now and with a system like our it is always the child's side that the state takes and like shadowx mentions best thing to do is stay calm and that will help you to think clearly and try to resolve this situation. Although I maybe off about this but usually the first slap would be looked past, but the second one will most likely get you into trouble and that is how the state will see it. The best suggestion I would see and most likely child services will mention this too is get family counciling and try to figure everything out and see how things can be solved.

 

Hopefully everything gets solved and she stops acting like a brat who needs to get her own way, because it doesn't happen like that and those who live that kind of life will always head for trouble. Though it sounds a bit cruel throw her trouble making in her face because if I remember correctly she likes to keep skipping school and stuff like, but whatever do don't let make you feel guilty for what you did or she will walk all over because of that. Hopefully the state won't be retarded and do the smart thing and that is trying to get you and her in counciling.

 

Heck should send her to one of those scared straight programs that should straighten her out, but hang in there and let us know whats going on.

[krazygoddess 0]

TYVM Saint Michael For the hugs it is greatly needed and appreciated. I have been crying on and off nonstop since last night. I dont know if I am more upset with her for her lies and the way she acted or with myself for snapping and slapping her in the face. Anyway. Tyvm again and yes I have talked about her skipping school alot on here and have always had problems with her. But she is my child and I love her. Anyway Things can only get better because they cant really get any worse.

[cangor 0]

What your daughter did was absolutely awful.... I mean you shouldn't have hit her, as a teenager myself I know something like that is really hurtful and insulting, but given the circumstances that's definitely not abusive... but no matter what the circumstances it's your daughter's fault for being so disrespectful and.... I don't know what to say that can possibly be comforting, but I hope somehow you and your daughter make up.... teenagers are stupid and we do a lot of bad stuff just because we don't know how to deal with some things. I don't know your daughter's situation but assuming it wasn't your fault, either she'll make up with you eventually or else she really does need time away to think about what she did and eventually she'll realize her fault... Don't be too hard on yourself, people aren't perfect and we all snap sometimes.

[rvalkass 5]

I'm sorry to sort of go against the grain here, but what you did was simply wrong. You just don't slap people in the face unless it is in self defence, which in this case it doesn't appear to have been.

 

My 17 yr old has always been my problem child she has major attitude and treats me very badly, I have put up with it for a long time and yesterday I just snapped.

If this has been a problem for a long time, have you looked for help? I know it sounds harsh, but if you haven't then that is partly your fault. If it has been such a problem that it has escalated to this level, then it seems both of you should have sought help a while ago to sort out your differences and repair the relationship between you.

 

I was trying to talk to her yesterday and it became a argument like it usually does. She was yelling at me and screaming everyother word was f*** this and f*** that and you are a b**** and so on. A friend of mine was over and walked in from the other room and told her dont you talk to your mother like that, And then she started in on her f*** you and mind your own business and so on it got bad I stood up and walked over to her sitting on the couch to slap her in the face and before I touched her she kicked me so hard in the stomach I almost went backwards over the coffee table.

As the saying goes: Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me. You will find that that is the same way most people will look at it. Your daughter has said some hurtful things to you, and I know that is a horrible feeling, but you don't slap someone for it. I know this will also sound slightly odd, but your daughter acted perfectly correctly by kicking you. If a person is confronted by someone trying to cause them physical pain, then they can do whatever they can to stop them. If you approached her, and tried to slap her in the face, then she acted well within her rights to use reasonable force to stop you.

 

Well that was it for me I jumped on her and turned her sideways and spanked her behind, and slapped her in the face. she got mad we argued some more and she left.

You made the whole situation much worse by proceeding to attack your daughter for a second time, and this time succeeding. If you had left it after your first try, it would be seen just as you flipping out, and left at that. But getting up and trying again shows that you were determined to carry this attack through to the end, and it was not something necessarily spontaneous.

 

She went down the street to a neighbors house and told them that I and my friend had beat the S*** out of her with our fists. I couldnt believe it.

Your daughter certainly shouldn't have lied like that, and in situations like this it can be hard to know who to believe. However, it may very well explain how she feels right now. It can be very distressing for a child to have their parent turn on them and start physically abusing them.

 

I drove down to the park to try to talk to her and she walked up to my window and started screaming at me again. I slapped her again in the face and left.

It has now become premeditated. You have actively gone looking for your daughter, and proceeded to attack her again. If it comes down to it in a court, you've just made this a whole lot worse for yourself. If you hadn't calmed down enough to avoid physically attacking your daughter again, why did you go looking for her?

 

I came home and about 20 minutes later the police were here. I told him everything exactly what happened and he said it doesnt look good for me because of the welt on her face. I am still in shock here. for one I cant believe I snapped like that I have never EVER hit any of my kids. But she has had this comeing for a long time and I couldnt take it anymore. But now Im in big trouble with alot of reprocussions.

If you've never been bad tempered before then that should allow for some discretion in your favour when everything gets decided. However, if she has had this coming for a long time, why did you not seek help for you both? If your relationship was damaged to this level then you both should have sought help to repair it long ago.

 

My daughter has always been full of lies she tells alot of stories and I dont know what she has told the police, but they have taken her away from me over this. She is not aloud back here and is going to be put in foster care and I am left with a mess of police and children services.

They will initially take her away as a precaution until they can determine exactly what has happened, and whether she is at risk if she stays with you. You have to remember how this looks to both the police and the foster services: You have physically abused your daughter twice, and attempted once.

 

Again, I have never hit any of my kids and I cant believe this is happening. I am so upset with myself for snapping like I did, I know I should have not hit her. But I cant believe all I am going to have to go through to get past this and I cant believe that they took her from me for smacking her, And now I risk loosing my little ones I will be watched and critisized on everything I do with my children now. I guess I am just sort of venting here so I will stop now before I ramble on and make no sense. I made this topic a poll because I want and need different opinions. please be honest. Did I commit child abuse? Is there such a thing as a child that needs to be smacked? Is there anyone out there with some similiar experinece that can offer me some advice? please HELP if there is. Thanks Krazy.

From what you have said, I must say that it appears you didn't just snap, as you actively went out looking for your daughter, and attacked her a second time. If you had just snapped you would have calmed down before trying to see her, and taken the same approach as your daughter - just walk away. You also didn't just smack her, but physically attack her twice, and fail a further attempt.

 

From what you have said, and in my own opinion, it appears your daughter behaved in the more grown-up way. She acted once in self defence, and rather than continue to argue, attack you, or risk being attacked again by you, she walked away from the situation. You, however, carried it on by looking for her, and it appears her possible fears of further attacks were well-founded, and you proceeded to slap her again.

 

If I've caught the wrong end of the stick, if I've misunderstood anything, or if you disagree with what I've said then please tell me, and I'll listen.

[krazygoddess 0]

Rvalkass, I agree what I did was completely wrong and there is no excuse for it. But you must know I did not go looking for my daughter to go attack her again. I went to try to talk to her and find out why she was telling the neighbors lies, She was in my face screaming. But enough of that it still does not make what I did right in anyway. We have seeked help she has been in counsiling for a couple years and we have been in counsiling together for a few months. And for everyone who wanted to stay updated she did call me last night hyterically crying, she wants to come home and the police wont let her. She will meet with children services today and they will decide from there what to do. I told her she has to tell them she wants to come home, and that I dont know what is going to happen that I cant fix this. I want her home more than anything, but was told I cannot be around here or I will be arrested. This has been VERY hard as we live in a very small town population under 1000 so she is only a couple blocks away at the moment until children services takes her, and I have wanted to just go pick her up so badly. Anyway thank you all for your feedback, I am off to bed I have not really slept at tall the past couple days.

[innosia 1]

Ok where to start is has been a while since I have posted been going through alot and yesterday it all got worse. Ok I have 4 kids 18,17,6 and 5. Three girls and one boy the boy is 6. My 17 yr old has always been my problem child she has major attitude and treats me very badly, I have put up with it for a long time and yesterday I just snapped. I was trying to talk to her yesterday and it became a argument like it usually does. She was yelling at me and screaming everyother word was f*** this and f*** that and you are a b**** and so on. A friend of mine was over and walked in from the other room and told her dont you talk to your mother like that, And then she started in on her f*** you and mind your own business and so on it got bad I stood up and walked over to her sitting on the couch to slap her in the face and before I touched her she kicked me so hard in the stomach I almost went backwards over the coffee table. Well that was it for me I jumped on her and turned her sideways and spanked her behind, and slapped her in the face. she got mad we argued some more and she left. She went down the street to a neighbors house and told them that I and my friend had beat the S*** out of her with our fists. I couldnt believe it. I drove down to the park to try to talk to her and she walked up to my window and started screaming at me again. I slapped her again in the face and left. I came home and about 20 minutes later the police were here. I told him everything exactly what happened and he said it doesnt look good for me because of the welt on her face. I am still in shock here. for one I cant believe I snapped like that I have never EVER hit any of my kids. But she has had this comeing for a long time and I couldnt take it anymore. But now Im in big trouble with alot of reprocussions. My daughter has always been full of lies she tells alot of stories and I dont know what she has told the police, but they have taken her away from me over this. She is not aloud back here and is going to be put in foster care and I am left with a mess of police and children services. Again, I have never hit any of my kids and I cant believe this is happening. I am so upset with myself for snapping like I did, I know I should have not hit her. But I cant believe all I am going to have to go through to get past this and I cant believe that they took her from me for smacking her, And now I risk loosing my little ones I will be watched and critisized on everything I do with my children now. I guess I am just sort of venting here so I will stop now before I ramble on and make no sense. I made this topic a poll because I want and need different opinions. please be honest. Did I commit child abuse? Is there such a thing as a child that needs to be smacked? Is there anyone out there with some similiar experinece that can offer me some advice? please HELP if there is. Thanks Krazy.

Some children might need attention on what they are demanding, the root of this problems may arise from something happen in the past, which build up in her to why she is having such an attitude. Parents should tell the children what they should and should not, and I don't know what really happens and how it become such a mess.

For me, the first thing you should know is to realize what happens already happens, let's just accept the fact that she is carried away, and now what is left behind is the scar that she made, you should accept it as a truth. Though neighbors or people will show different attitude, just accept it. And she should learn something from the lesson that she herself brought upon, though it might be hard one, but at least as parent, we had given what we should and told her what she should not, more than it is what she should bear alone.

The fact if she is already being counseled for years then do as follows
1. stop the counseling
2. pay no attention to her, hopes that she learn what she will get if she is under no attention at all
3. let what she is wanting and let her be, this is quite hurt as she will go in mistakes, but if that's what she want then we can not actually preventing her, we could only do what we could
Edited September 22, 2008 by innosia (see edit history)

[kingjim007 0]

Talk to a professional in the area of the law and family services. You ARE at risk of losing your children and you need to be very careful. You need to be informed as to how to answer questions. It is VERY easy for these services to take your children away so you need to get good advice. Don't be so naive to assume just because you tell the truth to the police and family services they will believe you and all will be well. I have heard many horror stories of these services coming and taking a child's word over the parents and parents losing children. Get good advice, I am not saying to lie but to answer very carefully and to know how the system works and what they are looking for. This is the world we live in where a parents rights are severely diminished.Your daughter has issues as do you. The issue of respect is obvious. There is none. You need to be consistent and lay down what is acceptable. She needs to grow up and take responsibility for her attitude. If she really thinks she will be happier living with strangers then let her. Maybe she will come to her senses. But you need counseling and support not only for yourself but to show you are taking control over what happened and you are a fit parent. So counseling to help you cope with all this and grow and legal help to help with the mess. If you can't afford it then think again. Can you afford to lose your kids? beg borrow or steal if you have to but get good help.On another note I will tell a quick story that is politically incorrect. A lot of this type of adolescent behavior is because of cultural weak spots. Children spend to much time with their peers and not with adults. My old work mate was from Cook Islands an Island in the Polynesia. His son was hanging around with local gang boys, was disrespectful and was becoming violent. As they say bad company corrupts good morals. His father threatened to 'give him a hiding' to which the son replied 'if you do I will call the cops'. It's a stupid world we live in...'spare the rod spoil the child'-yes I know it's unpopular but does it work? (this is contentious I know)So he understood the system. He said to his son that he was going home to the Island and because his son was special he could come with him....their special trip. When they got there his son was happy thinking he had some power over his dad. Then he got what was coming to him. If he was going to act like a man and challenge his dad and disrespect him and threaten him like a man then he would be treated like one. My old mate gave his son a good hiding....in fact his son went to hospital to recover from his wounds....after all he was VERY bad :lol:This sort of thing is more acceptable in the Islands where respect for your elders is taught. Not abuse but respect. When they returned to Australia his son straightened out. He left the gang, returned to school and started treating everyone including his father and self with respect.Do I agree with this? Was it right or wrong? Who are we to judge? It got results and probably saved that boy from a life of crime and alienation from his family. What is important is that the system is different where you are. For most people it is easy to understand why you reacted-you were simply pushed too far. If she wasn't your daughter there would be no question of your reaction. You must not beat yourself up (excuse the pun) over this. If you have a problem fix it but be fair on yourself.But watch what you say and how you conduct yourself around family services. Don't become another horror story. Get good advice and be prepared. Use this opportunity to think about boundaries and parental involvement for your other children. Try and keep some structure through this ordeal and keep this normal as possible.Most of all don't give up, be strong, have some courage and ASK for help.Be well.KJ

[rvalkass 5]

Rvalkass, I agree what I did was completely wrong and there is no excuse for it. But you must know I did not go looking for my daughter to go attack her again. I went to try to talk to her and find out why she was telling the neighbors lies, She was in my face screaming. But enough of that it still does not make what I did right in anyway.

I'm sorry it came out that way. What I meant was that that is how the foster services and police will see the situation. Of course I know that your motivation was not to attack your daughter, and that you were trying to resolve the situation, but that is not necessarily how it will be seen by everyone.

We have seeked help she has been in counsiling for a couple years and we have been in counsiling together for a few months.

That should count in your favour. You have been trying to work it out, and whatever you are doing at the moment simply isn't working. Perhaps you need to discuss a different method of help for yourself and your daughter. A willingness to try something else that may help you both should demonstrate that you are a good person, and this was just a one-off incident.

Of course, I wish you all the best and I hope you get to see your daughter soon, and get back together

[anwiii 17]

Is there anyone out there with some similiar experinece that can offer me some advice? please HELP if there is. Thanks Krazy.

ouch ouch ouch! ummm, you're right. you shouldn't have snapped. you didn't just hit her once, but twice. so you actually snapped twice in hitting your child. she may have had it coming, but you need to get in touch with your emotions because they learn from your own actions. wether your daughter had a welt or not makes no difference in my eyes. she's 17. almost a legal adult with some adult rights in some states. you came after her the first time. that's why she kicked you. i guess she was defending herself. second time i guess you came after her again since you had to get out of your car.

your daughter was right. it wasn't any business of your friend to butt in. your friend was wrong. this was about you and your daughter and i know she didn't just walk in the room *BLEEP*ing and screaming and cursing for no reason so you left some of the story out.

doesn't sound good to me. two things here that bother me. it bothers me that you snapped and let emotion control you even if she had it coming. it also bothers me that your child acts out the way she does.

well i can safely assume she doesn't act out for no reason so have you ever tried to figure out the reason why she was always this problem child? it could be 1 of many things so i think you should dig deep and find out why. i would try to find out why ASAP because the longer you wait, the more damage will be done and will be harder to reconcile.

now you talkin' to someone who doesn't believe in hitting a child under any circumstance except if there is something the child does that puts him/her in danger or someone else in danger. there are other means. you are not dealing with a child anymore even if your daughter acts like one. she's not a child so don't treat her like one. you had 17 years to guide her. usaully a child consists of how they were raised and treated. if this is not a parenting issue, then i would suggest looking in to a possible chemical imbalance which there is medication for......

i wouldn't be so quick to assume a chemical imbalance though. it's usually a parenting issue and possibly a sibbling issue combined. she's still young enough to sit down with her and get to the bottom of things. she is also old enough where you will need to start respecting how she feels.

you may be screwed with the cops since even if she doesn't press charges, there's evidence enough for the d/a to press charges without your daughter. good luck with that but that shouldn't be a main concern here.

i urge you to start listening to your daughter. really pay attention in what she says. there are reason why she says things and i feel her voice is not being heard and not everyone is putting an effort in to that.

now obviously, i probably said things you didn't want to hear. even so, i was as gentle as possible. remember. if you keep doing the same things, expect the same results where nothing changes. it's about time to change your mindset so you can connect to your daughter. she's your baby and always will be even if she is almost an adult now. you can be the best mothers out there in this world....even what i call a natural mother and still not know what to do. that's ok. the problem may not even be with you but your daughter. but as a mother, it's your obligation to find out what the problem is and you will never be able to do that if you get so emotional to snap. obviously your daughter needs help. obviously she feels she isn't being heard in how she feels. i would suggest trying very hard unselfishly to be there for your daughter and get to the bottom of the problems where there are probably deep underlying issues easy to be missed and ignored.....except for your daughter. she feels a certain way for a reason.

i really don't know what else to say on this one. you really didn't give that much detail on your daughter except for the fact that she is a problem child and you hold little respect for her. if somehow she feels what you feel about her then that may be one of the problems. who knows....

don't hit your kids no more. you can discipline them in other ways.

[innosia 1]

how is it?i think the post is already quite long, how is going on then? any further story?so we may know if we could slap our child or not...

[sheepdog 10]

I am really sorry you are going threw this. I don't think you should feel guilty for slapping her. After all, she was in your face cussing and screaming at you, and then kicked you hard enough to knock you over, so you are not the abuser in this incident. Personally, I think the only thing you did wrong was to wait too long to smack her. You probably should of done it 10 years or so ago. Once a kid is 17 they are a lost cause for disipline. I'm sure you feel terrible, and I hope you can get things worked out.