The Legality Of Torrents

[sakmac 0]

Hi guys,Now I am a keen user of torrents, to send photos and videos of me to my cousins in france. It is much cheaper that actually cd's and all the rest of it. But recently, while looking for a new torrent client (I've decided on utorrent), I came across several sites talking about how a torrent site will record the ip's of the visitors in a bid to crack down on illegal users. Now this struck me as odd, because why would they want to do that? That's when I ran a search for torrents and noticed the plethora of torrents available.Now, what I was wondering here, is that as it is not strictly illegal to download torrents, and as the website makes no indication as to the legality of the torrent, was it the fault of the visitor who decided to download the torrent, or the uploader, who owned a genuine copy of the software or music in question, and what if the userused a loophole such as I was testing it.Does that work, and does anyone have any experience?Thanks.

[surbjit 0]

Torrents are not illegal it just depends what you downloading. E.g downloading torrented games is illegal as you didnt purchase the game-instead you got it for free which is against the whole thing of selling games.However, some sites upload there things via torrents and upload links to where you can download them from- this is legal as the company had uploaded it themselves.Im using Bit-torrent as my client at the moment. Its getting faster and faster- If you have port forwarded so in the future im guessing it will be one of the fastest torrent clients out there.

[sakmac 0]

Thanks,What I am just wondering is that if you already own a copy of that genuine software, would it be legal if you uploaded that software to a torrent, and then used it yourself to download. Or on the other side, what if you decided to purchase the key for a cheaper price than the software, and then downloaded the software itself from torrents. Would that be considered legal.Also, thanks for your recommendation of bittorrent. Utorrent right now is going fine for me with speeds of up 300 kb/s which is the same when i do http downloads, but if my speed detiorates I will try your recommendation. Thanks!

[rpgsearcherz 5]

To answer the question about software and all... Here's how it works.In terms of how we *feel*, if we own a key, downloading off a torrent should be fine. We also feel that uploading it to ourself is fine. In all actuality, this isn't the case at all.For a recent example, look at Warhammer Online. We were forced to download the client at a rate of a whopping 30 kb/s or so from the Fileplanet servers. A few people decided to make a torrent for the client(You couldn't even run it without a legitimate username and password, so there was no chance of anyone hacking it or anything) and they got banned for it. Why? Because they allowed people to use that instead of Fileplanet.In terms of games, even if you copy your legitimate PS2/Xbox/Xbox 360/etc. game and have your system modchipped, you're breaking the law. Their laws say that it doesn't matter how much you paid, because what you paid for was *that key* and *that disc*. Even borrowing a friends' disc for a game you have a key for is illegal.As to whether I agree with the rules and laws or not...I don't. I feel that if you paid for a key, the game is just on an easy to use format. It's ridiculous to say that you are not allowed to find another median to get the media from.But that's the way it is.

[sakmac 0]

I completely agree with you rpgsearchz, but when it comes to Microsoft issue's isn't it a rather grey issue because Microsoft themselves don't really care about the downloading because many sites also allow for the software to be downloaded, so I suppose you could download Microsoft's software from torrents.Also, I suppose that the thing about the game console games is pretty much understood, but for many people, myself included, downloading video games is sort of out of the question. Aside from the inevitable question of the legal side, there's also the fact that these files are just too big, and most people can't really care to do what is mentioned. I suppose it is ridiculous because if you bought that key then you should have full right to install it how you choose, whether it be from usb or torrents, and if you follow the guidelines such as how much systems to install on, it should be perfectly ok.

[truefusion 3]

I completely agree with you rpgsearchz, but when it comes to Microsoft issue's isn't it a rather grey issue because Microsoft themselves don't really care about the downloading because many sites also allow for the software to be downloaded, so I suppose you could download Microsoft's software from torrents.

If you can download the software outside of torrents on another site, then there would be no need for torrents. Speed would not be the issue here; if the program can be purchased, there's not going to be any download issues. The intent or motive for wanting a torrent in this case would be for the extra programs that are bound to come with it. Use of those extra programs are illegal. No one's going to go through the effort of finding these torrents if they only wanted to use the demo or purchase the program. There's a reason behind every human act.

[rpgsearcherz 5]

Actually, truefusion, that's not necessarily true. I've had a few cases personally where I have used torrents to download games I have the legal rights to own.Something a lot of people do not consider is siblings and/or children. For example, I let my 8 year old brother borrow my Command and Conquer Renegade discs at one point(he loved games...) and he lost the discs but not the case or the cd key. Downloading the game again allowed me to reinstall it again. After all, I could have just copied the discs to begin with, right?Now as to why I did it, there are many laws I disagree with. I am not condoning the archival backup of your own media, but whether I look at it from a moral standpoint or a spiritual one, I see nothing wrong with it.To turn it into an analogy. Imagine you just bought a new car. You have the car for 3 hours(while you drive it for the first time) and then park the car and someone steals your radio. What are you going to do? Obviously go get another radio(warrantee/insurance aren't being counted here - just roll with it).Now you head out to the store to get your new radio, and you find one that you like. Take it up to the counter and the clerk says "I'm sorry sir, unless you buy another 2009 Dodge Viper, we are unable to sell you this radio." From this point on, you are unable to buy any radios without buying a brand new car.To me, this is the exact same situation. Of course it's a more drastic view, but regardless it has the same principles to it.Even worse is when you pay $300+ for Microsoft Office XP(we needed it for my mother). You take it home, install it and verify it, and obviously it's going to work.A week later your PC crashes for whatever reason, or you get a new HDD, and you reinstall Office XP once you get it up and running again. At this point, you can not verify the program without calling Microsoft and telling them why you need to reinstall it, and speak to them for 10 minutes while they question you about your intentions, why you reformatted instead of just fixing your issues, and on and on.And yes, I went through that quite a few times with Office XP before I finally moved on to OpenOffice. It seems as if their rules are turning from keeping down piracy(who bypass that anyways) to keeping their actual customers unhappy.Again, this is not to condone anything illegal, it is giving my view on what is and is not right. At one point, maybe the companies that make software will also start to care about their customers, rather than just the money they will get.

[sakmac 0]

If you can download the software outside of torrents on another site, then there would be no need for torrents. Speed would not be the issue here; if the program can be purchased, there's not going to be any download issues. The intent or motive for wanting a torrent in this case would be for the extra programs that are bound to come with it. Use of those extra programs are illegal. No one's going to go through the effort of finding these torrents if they only wanted to use the demo or purchase the program. There's a reason behind every human act.

Wrong, because on some download sites, when I'm trying to download a software the speeds are just so amazingly slow that I almost want to give up, but instead I use torrents, and as there are loads of seeds to it, it appears I'm not the only one.

Also, what happens if something happens and you lose a game disc or something something similiar then u r stuck, or you could go and use torrents. But I suppose that you are write in some cases, but what if the reason behind that huuman act is simply to replace a game disc. And it;s not much effort finding torrents, in fact it's practically seraching google. I think that the only reason torrents are used illegally is because of the accessibilty and the diverse use of them, and no effort to curb the illegal users from the larger companies.

[minimcmonkey 0]

I just dont use torrents.Many of them are legal, but many are not, and its often hard to tell.No torrent is actually going to say "LOOK HERE ILEGAL TORRENT TO CLOSE AND SUE" And some of them are packed full of files infected with trojans.They are a waste of time, and many are contributing to piracy!

[rpgsearcherz 5]

I agree that it's hard to tell what is "legal" and what isn't, but you should use your own discretion with that. As I stated, really any use of torrents and/or archiving media, whether you own it or not, is deemed as "illegal."It even goes as far as saying that if you own a music CD, and rip it to put it on your Ipod, you are breaking the law. That is classified as illegal because you purchased the CD version, not the MP3/WMA/etc. version that you now have in conjunction.To better explore this, it also goes the same with movies. This is why some movies now have a code for a free "digital download" of the same movie. It's not to give out to other people, it is so that you can have a *legal* .avi or whatever format it is, for yourself.The sad part is that although it is not legal to archive the media in it's various formats, many system creators use it to get you to purchase their items. Look at the Xbox, PSP, etc. They all play your mp3 cd's, and even speak of it, but really it's not even legal to have them.So looking at the chances of being charged, they are low. The reason is simple - the law makes no sense.There are thousands and thousands of laws that make no sense at all, and therefore are not followed through with.So you can look at my post as explaining that it *is* illegal, but shouldn't be, and it's clear that everyone but RIAA and MPAA believe the same.

[truefusion 3]

Even worse is when you pay $300+ for Microsoft Office XP(we needed it for my mother). You take it home, install it and verify it, and obviously it's going to work.
A week later your PC crashes for whatever reason, or you get a new HDD, and you reinstall Office XP once you get it up and running again. At this point, you can not verify the program without calling Microsoft and telling them why you need to reinstall it, and speak to them for 10 minutes while they question you about your intentions, why you reformatted instead of just fixing your issues, and on and on.

And yes, I went through that quite a few times with Office XP before I finally moved on to OpenOffice. It seems as if their rules are turning from keeping down piracy(who bypass that anyways) to keeping their actual customers unhappy.

Again, this is not to condone anything illegal, it is giving my view on what is and is not right. At one point, maybe the companies that make software will also start to care about their customers, rather than just the money they will get.

M'ks, so it's not necessarily the case about wanting the extra programs.

To turn it into an analogy. Imagine you just bought a new car. You have the car for 3 hours(while you drive it for the first time) and then park the car and someone steals your radio. What are you going to do? Obviously go get another radio(warrantee/insurance aren't being counted here - just roll with it).
Now you head out to the store to get your new radio, and you find one that you like. Take it up to the counter and the clerk says "I'm sorry sir, unless you buy another 2009 Dodge Viper, we are unable to sell you this radio." From this point on, you are unable to buy any radios without buying a brand new car.

There is a problem with your analogy concerning its context: You're implying that if you or someone else lost your game (i.e. "radio"), or if someone stole it, which you still have the keys (i.e. game license) to, you'd go out and buy a new one rather than "download" (couldn't find a better word to fit the analogy) a new "radio" (i.e. game). Therefore speaking against downloading from torrents.

Wrong, because on some download sites, when I'm trying to download a software the speeds are just so amazingly slow that I almost want to give up, but instead I use torrents, and as there are loads of seeds to it, it appears I'm not the only one.

"Some download sites," just go to the ones that aren't slow—that's what i do when my download doesn't seem to want to start; download sites almost always have multiple mirrors.

Also, what happens if something happens and you lose a game disc or something something similiar then u r stuck, or you could go and use torrents. But I suppose that you are right in some cases, but what if the reason behind that human act is simply to replace a game disc. And it's not much effort finding torrents, in fact it's practically seraching google. I think that the only reason torrents are used illegally is because of the accessibilty and the diverse use of them, and no effort to curb the illegal users from the larger companies.

That is slightly outside the scope of my statement. You are entitled to a back-up, but using the extra programs that come with the torrents that are made to act against the program you are downloading is illegal. And torrents are used for illegal purposes because there will always be people with such agendas.

[rpgsearcherz 5]

If you want to break it down into what he was asking originally - are torrents legal or illegal?There is one answer. If you own the actual rights to the information(not bought - unless you bought the sole rights to it), then yes, it's legal. Examples are:Home MoviesMovies you madePictures you took(not of games - not on your pc, etc.)Programs you made yourselfAside from things of that nature it is illegal.

[networker 0]

It's easy to tell what's legal and what isn't.If you're downloadingsomething for free that should have been paid for and sent throughan unauthorized third party,then it is illegal. Simple enough but true. What can I say about that? Legalize it!In the memory of Peter Tosh! Nah.Only joking about that.I've never used torrents before although I wouldnever admit to it even if I did.Wherever theres a free market and people get tired of paying top dollar there'll be a black market.That's basic economics. If you do want to risk downloading the software for free,it's your choice to take the risk of viruses and trogans though.It's very much a ying and yang thing.

[jlhaslip 4]

What is a Torrent? and why would I use one?

[truefusion 3]

What is a Torrent? and why would I use one?

A torrent is a file with information about other, predefined files which informs a torrent client about them. It's a more manual way for peer-to-peer file sharing. Ethical websites tend to use them to reduce bandwidth. Many Linux distributers provide torrents for that reason.