Cpu Upgrade But It Doesn't Work

[DecemberPhoenix 0]

Okay, so, here's the deal. The guy who originally installed my old CPU installed it in a manner that the fan on top of it melted off any product numbers and all that. All I know is that the place it hooks into says mPGA478B. It was originally a Celeron. Well, when taking it out, the pins were bent, so I needed to buy a new one. I went online to find one, searched the mPGA478B thing, cross referenced it with the Dell, it said everything was a-okay. BUT, once I received it, it didn't work. The new one is an Intel Pentium 4, Northwood Core 478 Socket with specs 2.6GHz, 512 KB 800MHz. I've read that you CAN interchange a Celeron with a Pentium...but looking closely I also realized that the inside of it (those little rows of rectangles...I'm not a computer person so I'm not sure what they are called) are vertical, rather than horizontal like the old one. Now, does the direction of these affect whether or not it works? When I turn it on, the power light comes on, the fans work, but it just beeps. I've looked up the Phoenix BIOS codes, and the closest it comes to is the faulty CPU sound, so obviously that doesn't help out much to me.

 

So, first off, I'm wondering if this part is even compatible, and if so, is there actually something (other than actually putting it in the computer) that I'm needing to do because I'm changing from a Celeron to a Pentium? Please keep in mind with that, though, that I can't run the computer it's on, so I can't log onto that one to download any upgrades or whatnot.

 

Here is the information on the CPU and computer, the best I can figure. Let me know if more info is needed.

 

 

Computer:

 

Dell

Serial Number: F7V8X11

There are two numbers written on the back: 76850264 and 7360D46

Model Number: MTC2

MoBo Rev: A00

 

Pentium CPU:

Intel Pentium 4

2.6GHz/512/800

SL6WH

7329A635

 

6334A645

0729

 

 

 

That's all I can find, unless you need the really long numbers on any of the serial code bars anywhere. If so let me know.

 

 

Thanks

[xboxrulz1405241485 0]

Make sure that the golden arrow is aligned with the one on the motherboard. Failure to do so will cause the processor to not work or burn up. Please also make sure that you apply proper amount of thermal grease before installing the fan and turning on the computer or else your CPU will FRY on the spot. Failure to reapply thermal grease after you dismount the heatsink off the old processor and pop the heatsink on to the new one w/ out the new thermal grease will kill the system.

More info: http://forums.xisto.com/no_longer_exists/

P.S: Your chipset does support a Pentium 4 2.66 GHz Socket 478 processor: http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/chipsets/chipsets-overview.html

xboxrulz

[Atomic0 0]

It is possible that the CPU or the motherboard is faulty, causing the computer not to boot up correctly. Your best option if you are not experienced in hardware upgrades is to get your local computer technician to try an identify any problems with your current upgraded configuration. Most have special testing cards to identify problems with the hardware.

[levimage 0]

If you can try using you older processor.. Go into the BIOS. When you are in the BIOS if you can manually override the Voltage try increasing the it by +0.1 V for the CPU and memory. You might want to do it quick and use a clean application of thermal grease between settings. It worked for me one time when I didn't have the Internet to look up the processor voltage.

[darasen 0]

Based upon the Service tag number you gave the machine is going to have several problems with the CPU you listed as a replacement.

One of the issues is going to be that the Dell you listed only has a Front Side Bus (FSB) of 400 Mhz. Additionally your power supply only provides 200 watts.

Thus in short the processor is simply too new for the rig in which you are trying to place it.

Additonal information:

The mPGA478B is simply the socket designation.

DellSerial Number: F7V8X11

That is your service tag number. This number gives you access to an array of information on the Dell site. Your model is a Dimension 2300. It was shipped on 10/3/2002.

Your Bios revision should be the A02.

Lastly you SHOULD be able to up the processor to a Celeron 2.5 Ghz. If I am not mistaken the 2.5 Celeron will run but a 2.5 Pentium will not. Why this is I do not know. The Dell documentation for a Dimension 4500 documentation makes that distinction. Though this may have changed since it was written. There are Pentium processors up to 2.8 Ghz that will run on a 400 FSB according to Intel's own documentation.
Edited August 24, 2008 by Darasen (see edit history)

[vujsa 0]

Well, I have a few concerns...First, the CPU information was "melted" off? Intel acid etches this to the microprocessor cover plate. Perhaps, the thermal compound used has made it difficult to read but cleaning that off real well should reveal the data you are looking for. I suggest rubbing alcohol (70 - 90% isopropyl alcohol solution) and a Q-Tip (cotton swap) or even tissues if you don't press too hard. You should also clean the mating surface of the heat sink to remove any old thermal compound if you don't get a new heat sink and fan with your new processor. Remember, you must use new thermal compound or a new thermal pad between the processor and heat sink to properly transfer heat from the processor to the heat sink. Otherwise, your processor will likely overheat and burn up.My second concern is the bent pins on the old processor. How did you manage that? Socket 478 is a ZIF socket. You drop the processor in with the arrows or triangles aligned and flip the lever to lock the processor. The exact opposite procedure is used to remove the processor. You flip the lever to unlock the processor and gently pull it out with two fingers. I suppose that if you don't take the heat sink off before you remove the processor, it would be difficult to remove the heat sink from the processor probably bending pins in the process.Of course, none of that helps you now...It is true that socket 478 Celeron processors are interchangeable with socket 478 Pentium 4 processors which have the same motherboard requirements. For example, I have a Pentium 4 socket 478 processor running in one of my computers but the motherboard is not capable of Hyper Threading technology which limits the processors that are compatible. Additionally, the motherboard I have is only capable of 533MHz front side bus so I can't drop an 800MHz processor in there.Now, I have a very old socket 478 motherboard. That socket had only been out for about 6 months then and most Pentium 4 computers were using the socket 423 processor. Perhaps you have a new enough motherboard in your system that it doesn't matter.It is possible that you damaged the socket when you removed the old process since you bent some pins in the process. The only way I would know if your new processor is compatible is if I knew what chipset the motherboard is using. I'm wondering about the guy that installed the Celeron processor... You said that you cross-referenced with Dell so is this a Dell computer? did he do an upgrade for you when he installed the Celeron processor that you removed? Why did you remove the old processor since you determined that you had to replace it after it was removed, I didn't gather that you were trying to upgrade the Celeron when you started.If you could answer a few of these questions, perhaps we can determine if your system is compatible.=============================================================================I guess that I took too long to write this, someone else has also responded...The maximum CPU frequency is reliant on the chipset used in the motherboard. So, the chipset must have a maximum speed set various processors. It could simply be that the 2.5 GHz P4 attempts to send too much data through the FSB for the chipset to handle but the less powerful 2.5 GHz Celeron processor doesn't overwhelm the system since it processes fewer instructions even though they run at the same frequency.Additionally, the motherboard could have been locked to prevent upgrading! Dell doesn't make money from people that upgrade their computers, they make money from people that buy new computers.vujsa

[DecemberPhoenix 0]

So many replies:Ok, first off, Atomic0...our local computer guy is the guy that put the celeron in wrong in the first place...and I live in the boonies. So, that's probably not the wisest choice, lol.Levimage: The old processor is kaput. It won't load into BIOS...that's why I'm having the problem. It just won't work.Darasen: The celeron we had was at least 800Mhz...I only know that because that's the minimum for what we use to play our games. The Celeron that was on it wasn't the original, I don't think. We need the 800 to play the games is the only reason we didn't go lower, or we'd just use the computer I'm on now (my ooooold computer...to upgrade this one...it'd be cheaper to buy a new one lol, and we just don't have that kinda money).vujsa: The reason the pins were bent is because the processor was connected to the fan...therefore using the lever was not an option. They weren't bent coming out, they were bent trying to be put back in because the lever wasn't able to be used. As for upgrades when this last one was installed, I don't know...it's my fiance's computer I'm trying to fix, and we weren't dating then. But I do remember him saying that he has had it upgraded to some extent, I just don't know how much. And he just left it there for the guy to work on it, I believe, and probably never asked questions, he was just glad it was fixed (that's just how he is...plus this was a while back and he's lucky to remember what he had for dinner 2 hours ago)As for removing it, I was cleaning the fan...it was so clogged I doubted it was doing much good, and the processor was attached to the fan. I've taken mine (the one I'm using) apart and put it back together like 100 times, so I do know how the insides go in, it's just that I don't think the processor is supposed to literally be attached to the fan...lol.I think I answered everything...if not lemme know.Thanks.

Edited August 24, 2008 by DecemberPhoenix (see edit history)

[darasen 0]

Darasen: The celeron we had was at least 800Mhz...I only know that because that's the minimum for what we use to play our games.

Double check what I wrote. The CPU that shiped with the PC was a 1.8 Mhz Celeron running with a 400Mhz Front Side Bus. This information comes directly from the Dell's records. The CPU you list as the one you have tried to replace the older one with needs to run at an 800Mhz Front Side Bus.

Front Side Bus is essentially the speed at with the information can run through the motherboard.

[xboxrulz1405241485 0]

@Darasen: I just checked Intel's website on Pentium 4s that are capable of 2.66 GHz, and it checks out that it can run on a 533MHz FSB.

 

 

Also, if I remembered properly, a processor can run at a lower FSB rating if the motherboard is slower than the processor. This is why I like AMD's approach. There is no FSB and the HyperTransport is known to be backwards compatible.

 

xboxrulz

[vujsa 0]

Darasen: The celeron we had was at least 800Mhz...I only know that because that's the minimum for what we use to play our games. The Celeron that was on it wasn't the original, I don't think. We need the 800 to play the games is the only reason we didn't go lower, or we'd just use the computer I'm on now (my ooooold computer...to upgrade this one...it'd be cheaper to buy a new one lol, and we just don't have that kinda money).

Okay, there is a little confusion about the various specifications used to measure computer components...There are 2 specifications used to measure a processor, the first is the processor speed or clock frequency. This is a measurement of how many instructions the processor can handle in one second. So a 2.5GHz processor can process 2.5 billion instructions per second. The second measurement is the front side bus speed which determines the amount of data that cat go in and out of the processor in one second. For both measurements, the hight the number, the faster the computer.
Additionally, there are different units to measure frequency at work here.
1000MHz = 1Ghz
So a 1.8GHz processor is the same a 1800MHz processor. The reason I bring this up is because you stated that your games require 800MHz which is a measurement of the processor speed, not the front side bus speed.
So having a FSB speed of 400 MHz will be fine as long as your processor speed is above 800MHz or 0.8GHz.
You may have to buy a used processor on eBay to get the issue resolved since a quick search has not found any online stores that sell new processors that would fit your system.

If Dell motherboards didn't require special power supplies (at least they did when your system was built), I'd suggest getting a new motherboard, CPU and memory.

I know this doesn't really help you but at least you should be able to make a couple of decisions that I'm sure you have been stressing out about.

vujsa

[levimage 0]

erhaps, the thermal compound used has made it difficult to read but cleaning that off real well should reveal the data you are looking for. I suggest rubbing alcohol (70 - 90% isopropyl alcohol solution) and a Q-Tip (cotton swap) or even tissues if you don't press too hard. You should also clean the mating surface of the heat sink to remove any old thermal compound if you don't get a new heat sink and fan with your new processor. Remember, you must use new thermal compound or a new thermal pad between the processor and heat sink to properly transfer heat from the processor to the heat sink. Otherwise, your processor will likely overheat and burn up.

Actually what also works in situations like this kind of cleaning is a 'razor blade' or if you can get your self on an exacto knife. That will work as well. Then you don't have to worry about static from the swabs or other cleaning wipes. Unless your in a lab or know somebody who has access to expensive static free swabs and chemicals.

It is true that socket 478 Celeron processors are interchangeable with socket 478 Pentium 4 processors which have the same motherboard requirements. For example, I have a Pentium 4 socket 478 processor running in one of my computers but the motherboard is not capable of Hyper Threading technology which limits the processors that are compatible. Additionally, the motherboard I have is only capable of 533MHz front side bus so I can't drop an 800MHz processor in there.

I was just working on a Dell laptop and this applies to some of their Dimension PC models. If you flash the BIOS from like an early version A02 or 03 to something current like A12/15, you might also read what changes were applied in all the subsequence bios updates and read something about now supports compatiblility for new intel, celeron, pentium m, or a faster FSB (front side bus). This can be done before you install your new processor.

Okay, there is a little confusion about the various specifications used to measure computer components...There are 2 specifications used to measure a processor, the first is the processor speed or clock frequency. This is a measurement of how many instructions the processor can handle in one second. So a 2.5GHz processor can process 2.5 billion instructions per second. The second measurement is the front side bus speed which determines the amount of data that cat go in and out of the processor in one second. For both measurements, the hight the number, the faster the computer.

There are more measurements when it comes to processors, but if you don't want to go in detail you should also mention the CACHE. Which is a temporary memory in your processor. It is faster than your ram and your FSB. This cache also keeps track of the process cycles your computer uses the most frequently like when using certain types of software - imaging, music, games -- therefore making you pc more responsive. Compare the caches when it comes to selecting from a specific group of processors. Also the amount of cache per a core is also significant when in comes to mult-core processors.

[xboxrulz1405241485 0]

If you want to go even further, the CACHE runs at clock speed so that it is definitely faster than the RAM modules that you insert in your motherboard. Then you have to factor in if you're using AMD processor, the HyperTransport speed instead of the FSB because after the Intel Nehalem processors, no one uses FSBs. Both Nehalem and AMD processors will feature memory controllers on the CPU which will be interesting to see the speed increase.xboxrulz

[iGuest 3]

Loose connections?Cpu Upgrade But It Doesn't Work

Replying to DecemberPhoenixI successfully PHYSICALLY swapped out P4 for P4 but only while wiggling the chip [pressing/pushing and wiggling, not pulling and wiggling] did I get like 2 .5 second responses.The original chip will allow all the fans to go on but nothing else.The second chip other then 2 flickers, did/does nothing.I think its time for a whole new motherboard anyhow, this one is 16 yrs old and I've maxed out every PC133 upgrade I could [actually put in PC 1333 in a PC 133 and went from 256Mb to 2Gb! and outboarded a 500Gb HDD by USB adapter] as well as adding an NIVIDIA GeFORCE 7300, video card.The old gal has served me well and now it seems to have failed to survive this last voyage from Minnesota to Arkansas [was exposed to the steam of ethylene glycol by way of ruptured heater hose, so that may have done it in] and needs a proper burial [sans new parts of course].I'm just a tinkerer so being totally unqualified, I may make a few major booboos along the way...

-reply by Delicious Vodka DeBlair