God

[chungster 0]

Today's Christmas isn't to celebrate the brith of Christ. Well at least for most of the world. Over 40,000. All think they're right. Only one can be (well some of them have the same view) Big Bang and Evolution. If g0d existed then those two things wouldn't have happend.

[the_furious1 0]

I never said that I am hard core Christian and that you should not play video games or watch movies or something ridiculous like that, but I just like to be fair. I don?t see anything wrong with trying to be fair!!!I know that whoever wrote that did not do any research because he or she is talking about Jews (Israel) killing everybody and that God wanted them to do that. Which is not true, 'cause one of the 10 commandments says: You shall not kill!!!! They did that on their own that was their choice!!!I don?t know why is everybody attacking me???? I was not offended by that text, that is his/hers personal opinion and respect that, and this is mine and you should too. I?m not trying to argue with you all, just sharing my thoughts! I don?t know why you all are saying lighten up; I'm not angry or offended!!!There is just one thing that bother me, and that is stating something without any arguments!!! And by the way the newest researches are saying that dinosaurs not live millions years ago, rather much later!!!

[AbstracT 0]

my friend says i'm a athiest because i do not go to church and do not take the bible seriously. I honestly think people take the bible too literal. I mean some of the lines in the bible are metaphors, similies, puns,.. etc. I do believe there is a higher being that made us but i'm not going to demean the higher being by trying to label it thru a word.

[biscuitrat 0]

Ah, but you're not basing your statement on fact. How do you know that he or she DIDN'T have a good source? I mean, you're not giving whoever wrote it a chance either. If they did study something and they did write that, what do we have to say? I appreciate your attempt to defend your faith, but it's all a bit of fun so you need to calm down a bit. We're not saying that you're wrong; we're only saying that we all have different opinions. That's what forums are for - to congregate and communicate.

[byrdhouse 0]

Amby,Interesting, but I don't know where you were heading with your prose. reading the replies I can see how people could be offended or pleased. Personally, I'll leave it up to God on this one. I can't fight every battle and I can find humor in my own beliefs/religion. Thank you for posting just the same...that's what we are here for...Take Care,Byrdhouse

[the_furious1 0]

This is my last reply on this, because we have totally different opinions and I can't debate any more!!!Just want to say that no GOOD source about Christianity would say something like that, maybe source against Christianity!!! The only good source is the Bible, and the Bible is not taking about that at all. Posted text is just personal opinion of a person who is sick of hearing Jesus this, Jesus that. This is my confession:I think the same way sometimes, because we teenagers don?t like of the restrictions and the Christianity is full of them!!! Can't do that, can't do this and that is all we hear, and because of that we are trying to justify ourselves by saying that all this Christianity stuff is not true!!! That is what probably happened to this person when he/she wrote that!!! Maybe not so don?t say ?How do you know??. I don?t, I just think that!!!And you know what, I'm fine with that 'cause my motto is "Live and let others to live", so what ever your life choices are they don't concern me, unless they involve me which they will probably not. I cant give you my opinion, but i wont try to turn you away from it!!!p.s. biscuitrat you don't have valid arguments either!!!

[Milk 0]

This is my last reply on this, because we have totally different opinions and I can't debate any more!!!

Okay wow, you're annoying. No offence. Just because two people have totally different opinions doesn't mean you can't debate. That's actually the foundation of debating, otherwise, you'd just be agreeing.

Just want to say that no GOOD source about Christianity would say something like that, maybe source against Christianity!!! The only good source is the Bible, and the Bible is not taking about that at all. Posted text is just personal opinion of a person who is sick of hearing Jesus this, Jesus that.

There is no good source for such information? So I guess my history book is a bad source then. What Amby posted, or what her friend said, was not from a 'bad source'. It could have been, but whatever. There are more sources that state that such as your history book and the encyclopedia, etc. The bible isn't a good source because all it is, is telling stories. Made up or not, they're all stories and theories (so to speak) about how earth and it's creatures came to be. It tells of morals and good values. What you are saying about bad sources and stuff, you're saying that history all in all is a bad source. It's not Amby's friend's "uninformed mind", it's you, not being able to accept the fact that the church was greedy and self absorpbed. If you'll know, in the renaissance, the church was causing all sorts of problems. The Church had sold things such as a free pass to heaven and indulgences etc. That is not from a bad source, it is truth. No one is saying your religion is bad, it's the people who followed/follow it. In the beginning, they were all about the good stuff, giving to people and trying to win converts, but the pope and stuff soon found they could take advantage of their job and allow you to pay your way into heaven without praying etc. So......if what I'm saying is all false, then I will kill myself.

Posted text is no necessarily an opinion. What you say in the text can be an opinion or not. I mean, if someone posted "Water is a liquid", then you're saying that's an opinion? I was sure it was universally accepted as fact.

This is my confession:I think the same way sometimes, because we teenagers dont like of the restrictions and the Christianity is full of them!!! Can't do that, can't do this and that is all we hear, and because of that we are trying to justify ourselves by saying that all this Christianity stuff is not true!!! That is what probably happened to this person when he/she wrote that!!! Maybe not so dont say How do you know?. I dont, I just think that!!!

Okay, first off, Christianity isn't full of restrictions. The ten commandments are all the restrictions there are. Not being able to play video games that have evil sources is not a restriction of Christianity, but a restriction of the Christian authorities who think the games are evil. The ten commandments don't state anything about not being able to play games or whatever.
All this Christianity stuff is not true? You mean all the beliefs and stuff about God? Well, that can vary among people. Quick note, you need to learn to make sense when you type. You'll get shot someday.

And you know what, I'm fine with that 'cause my motto is "Live and let others to live", so what ever your life choices are they don't concern me, unless they involve me which they will probably not. I cant give you my opinion, but i wont try to turn you away from it!!!

Okay.....so if you were fine with this topic, why did you make such a big deal about it? And of course whatever our "life choices" they won't concern you because you don't know any of the people here in real life (or you could but whatever) so I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't care.
You can't give your opinoin? This whole post you made was like a paradox then. This entire post was your 'opinion' so unless the definition of opinion has changed, you're wrong.

p.s. biscuitrat you don't have valid arguments either!!!

You and biscuitrat were not having an argument. You were stating something totally oblivious and she was just telling you what's wrong with you. >_>
And what was wrong with her 'arguments' anyways? The fact that she totally slapped the crap out of you? You're just angry that she made you look like a fool, and you continued on like you know everything. She was just snapping you back to reality. Or maybe not. Her intentions could have been totally different.

Blargh. I know you'll probably never get around to reading this anyways, but I just needed to say something. =/

[biscuitrat 0]

Thank you thank you thank you for completing my points. The Bible is just a book of fables that might have been based on what people actually said. Who's to say they weren't people out to monopolize on the gullible ancient people? Fables like those could be interpreted very loosely and how are we to say that any of them actually existed? Do we have proof? Is there some random archaeological evidence that can help us determine what really happened back then? True, there was probably a Jesus but was he really all some of us believe him to be? I mean, I believe in miracles, but not bringing people back to life and curing all sorts of things. He would have had to have some self-control over his conscience.

 

Which is why it would suck to be a messenger of God. You not only get persecuted but you have a list of things you need to do that may take over (or end) your life. Think of how that could impair your personal life!

[the_furious1 0]

I am writing this against my word, but that is the only way to explain myself!!!

Okay wow, you're annoying. No offence. Just because two people have totally different opinions doesn't mean you can't debate. That's actually the foundation of debating, otherwise, you'd just be agreeing.

I am not going to debate any more because nobody is sharing my opinion and I can't fight the world!!! I didnt mean that I'm not able to debate any more, I just don't want to.

There is no good source for such information? So I guess my history book is a bad source then. What Amby posted, or what her friend said, was not from a 'bad source'. It could have been, but whatever. There are more sources that state that such as your history book and the encyclopedia, etc. The bible isn't a good source because all it is, is telling stories. Made up or not, they're all stories and theories (so to speak) about how earth and it's creatures came to be. It tells of morals and good values. What you are saying about bad sources and stuff, you're saying that history all in all is a bad source. It's not Amby's friend's "uninformed mind", it's you, not being able to accept the fact that the church was greedy and self absorpbed. If you'll know, in the renaissance, the church was causing all sorts of problems. The Church had sold things such as a free pass to heaven and indulgences etc. That is not from a bad source, it is truth. No one is saying your religion is bad, it's the people who followed/follow it. In the beginning, they were all about the good stuff, giving to people and trying to win converts, but the pope and stuff soon found they could take advantage of their job and allow you to pay your way into heaven without praying etc. So......if what I'm saying is all false, then I will kill myself.
Posted text is no necessarily an opinion. What you say in the text can be an opinion or not. I mean, if someone posted "Water is a liquid", then you're saying that's an opinion? I was sure it was universally accepted as fact.

Your history book is not bad source, but it is not appropriate for this occasion. Let my explain why:
History book should and I hope is telling the facts that humans did sometime in history. One thing that history book is not talking about and all this conversation is about, is the Christianity. What ever you were talking what church did you were talking about leaders of the Roman Catholic Church. The text posted by Amby is talking about God not leaders of the Roman Catholic Church, so you are completely of the subject. God lets us have our choices and those were theirs so they dont have to do anything with Gods will. Gods will was to stop that and he did.
The stories it the Bible are more than just the stories, they are the guidelines for life.

No one is saying your religion is bad, it's the people who followed/follow it.

When I read that at first I was shocked, but then I felt sorry for you. It just amazes me what you think or what you have been thought to think, because you dont know anything about the Christian Religion. This comment of yours requires enormous correction: The people that did what wrote (Pope, etc.) would never do such a thing if they were true followers of the Christ. Christian religion never preached something like that; it was the people who wanted to take advantage of it. The conclusion is that the people who FOLLOW the Christ are not bad, it is the ones that think they are or knowingly take advantage of it.

Okay, first off, Christianity isn't full of restrictions. The ten commandments are all the restrictions there are. Not being able to play video games that have evil sources is not a restriction of Christianity, but a restriction of the Christian authorities who think the games are evil. The ten commandments don't state anything about not being able to play games or whatever.

I never said that playing video games is a restriction of the Christianity, dont put word in my mouth!!!! Just let me hit you with one thing, Apostles were not aloud to have any possessions, and the Apostles were the followers of the Christ. In my mind that is a restriction or sacrifice. How about I say sacrifices instead restriction, would that suit you better?
The Christian are called to live the live of Jesus Christ, and if his live was not full of sacrifice and dont know whose is!!!

All this Christianity stuff is not true? You mean all the beliefs and stuff about God? Well, that can vary among people. Quick note, you need to learn to make sense when you type. You'll get shot someday.

You said that I dont make sense when I type, I dont understand why. I am going to try to explain anyway. We are trying to justify ourselves by saying that all this Christianity stuff is not true!, means a person who did something that the Bible says is wrong is trying to convince him/herself that he/she actually didnt do anything wrong, because whatever is written in the Bible is not true and there will be no consequences. It was not me saying that the Bible is not true it was a person who was trying to justify him/herself. I hope that makes it clear.

Okay.....so if you were fine with this topic, why did you make such a big deal about it? And of course whatever our "life choices" they won't concern you because you don't know any of the people here in real life (or you could but whatever) so I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't care.

When I wrote you I did not mean the members of this forum, I meant every person in the world. I am fine with the topic, just sharing my opinion and trying to explain it. I did not mean to make big deal about it, I completely disagree with you so that is way it seems that way!!!

I cant give you my opinion, but i wont try to turn you away from it!!!

That was just a typo (typing error). I meant to say can instead of cant. That should explain it.


My final words to you are:
Knowledge is the key, if you spend some time studying the Bible (which you probably wont), and not making conclusions on the worst examples that dont represent it, you will probably know what am I talking about but until then youll be confused.

When you said that Popes actions represent Christianity, that is like you said that Denis Rodmans hair style represents basketball.

[bjrn 0]

Well... The pope's actions do represent all of Catholic Christianity. That's what the pope does.

 

Your definition of "true christianity" seem to be what you personally think is the right interpretation of the bible. Surely everyone should be able to interpret the bible in their own way, and if they make somthing ugly of it then so be it, but who are you to condemn them?

[bjrn 0]

Hmm. Looks like I can't edit my post, I wanted to preview, not post."but who are you to condemn them?" should read "but who are you to say what is christianity and what is not?".

[biscuitrat 0]

I especially wonder about the sacrifice part. Would you really want to throw away all your posessions to blindly follow some man who is "the son of god"? The Pope does represent the head of the Catholic church which is a pretty big branch. Not sure about all those crazy Protestent denominations.

I am not going to debate any more because nobody is sharing my opinion and I can't fight the world!!! I didnt mean that I'm not able to debate any more, I just don't want to.

Dude, the world's not against you. If you read back a bit, people did share your opinions but not on the same things. It's true that you're not able to debate anymore. You've been repeating the same things over and over again. Powerless to continue? Not at all. Read a bit of Christian history and get back to us. I'm Hindu so I'm no expert on it, but you don't have very good comebacks. I mean, Milk wrote about the history books - you attempted to parry by saying that the Roman Catholic church had problems in it. Now, back in Europe in the late 1500's there were several mini inquisitions between Catholics and Protestents. When new leaders got to the throne, they wanted a clear majority. Was either church the better? Not in my opinion. Both churchs teamed together during the Spanish Inquisition to search for heretics or nonbelievers. Hell, the Nazi's almost exterminated the Jewish population in Europe based on what? Religion. No church is better than any other and all religions have been persecuted in their time.

The stories it the Bible are more than just the stories, they are the guidelines for life.

So the fact that Jesus went and converted a whole bunch of people to his religion is a guildline for life? What about Daniel in the lion's den? No one today (except maybe Steve Irwin and animal doctors/zoologists) would go up to a random lion and pull a thorn from its foot and expect the lion to not kill them unless it was subdued already.

When I read that at first I was shocked, but then I felt sorry for you. It just amazes me what you think or what you have been thought to think, because you dont know anything about the Christian Religion. This comment of yours requires enormous correction: The people that did what wrote (Pope, etc.) would never do such a thing if they were true followers of the Christ. Christian religion never preached something like that; it was the people who wanted to take advantage of it. The conclusion is that the people who FOLLOW the Christ are not bad, it is the ones that think they are or knowingly take advantage of it.

I don't know if this is news for you, but Catholicism is a branch of
Christianity and guess what? They believe in Jesus too

We are trying to justify ourselves by saying that all this Christianity stuff is not true!, means a person who did something that the Bible says is wrong is trying to convince him/herself that he/she actually didnt do anything wrong, because whatever is written in the Bible is not true and there will be no consequences.

So let me try to decipher this. By saying Christianity is not true (hmm? It's a freaking huge religion. It has to be true.), people who do things the Bible says is wrong can get away with it? I don't believe in smiting. What kind of consequence am I going to get if I don't resurrect someone or do stuff like that? I'm supposed to follow Jesus's life if I'm a Christian, right?

Furious, we're not your enemies. You just aren't fighting hard enough. So far you haven't had a single arguable topic. Personally, you're a pretty bad debater. You're out of ideas and you're not trying hard enough to defend your faith. Plus you're attacking the Catholic church as not being Christian which is kind of mean of you. You're also saying that people should live by the Bible. That might have worked for bored people without lives several hundred years ago but this is a changing world.

[Milk 0]

Your history book is not bad source, but it is not appropriate for this occasion. Let my explain why:

History book should and I hope is telling the facts that humans did sometime in history. One thing that history book is not talking about and all this conversation is about, is the Christianity. What ever you were talking what church did you were talking about leaders of the Roman Catholic Church. The text posted by Amby is talking about God not leaders of the Roman Catholic Church, so you are completely of the subject. God lets us have our choices and those were theirs so they don?t have to do anything with God?s will. God?s will was to stop that and he did.

The stories it the Bible are more than just the stories, they are the guidelines for life.

Our history books do talk about Christianity, they just don't preach it like you seem to want. And what do you mean by God's will was to stop that? Stop us from having our own free will? Well that's not very nice...

 

When I read that at first I was shocked, but then I felt sorry for you. It just amazes me what you think or what you have been thought to think, because you don?t know anything about the Christian Religion. This comment of yours requires enormous correction: The people that did what wrote (Pope, etc.) would never do such a thing if they were true followers of the Christ. Christian religion never preached something like that; it was the people who wanted to take advantage of it. The conclusion is that the people who FOLLOW the Christ are not bad, it is the ones that think they are or knowingly take advantage of it.

What I have been thought to think? You mean what I've been taught to think? To think that the Church is bad and evil? Oh nononono. My parents are buddhists, and who's to say I ain't Christian? I actually was back in the day when I knew nothing of it. I did not know the religion or the things it has caused. And the more I learned about it, the more I hated it. I wouldn't go so far as to say I'm a theologian, but I can say enough to know what I'm talking about. I have a bible and I have read some of the books. The Pope never wrote any part of the bible. If they were true followers of Christ? You can't honestly expect to be a "true follower", if you get what I mean.....

 

You said that I don?t make sense when I type, I don?t understand why. I am going to try to explain anyway. ?We are trying to justify ourselves by saying that all this Christianity stuff is not true!?, means a person who did something that the Bible says is wrong is trying to convince him/herself that he/she actually didn?t do anything wrong, because whatever is written in the Bible is not true and there will be no consequences. It was not me saying that the Bible is not true it was a person who was trying to justify him/herself. I hope that makes it clear.

What I meant by you make no sense is that your sentence structures aren't exactly great. I'm not making fun of you or anything since English might not be your first language, but sometimes they are very hard to make out.

You make this sound as if the Bible is the final authority. You sound much like Martin Luther =/ The Bible is not the ruler of the world and it cannot and will not rule every person and Christianity will not succeed in making everyone obey those things in the Bible. That is why there are laws so there are consequences. People who do things against what the bible says aren't saying the bible is just a bunch of wishy washy crap. It'd be stupid to commit a murder just to prove to themselves the bible isn't true.

 

My final words to you are:

Knowledge is the key, if you spend some time studying the Bible (which you probably won?t), and not making conclusions on the worst examples that don?t represent it, you will probably know what am I talking about but until then you?ll be confused.

 

When you said that Pope?s actions represent Christianity, that is like you said that Denis Rodman?s hair style represents basketball.

Knowledge is key, and you don't seem to have any knowledge beyond attempting to defend yourself. You yourself do not seem to know anything about the history of Christianity and the wreck the Church has caused. You seem to only know that the Bible, taught to you, is true.

No, I won't spend time studying the Bible because it's a waste of time. I don't follow it and I don't plan on being a Christian Theologist. You yourself probably have not studied the Bible very thoroughly, but that's just what it looks like. I'm presenting the worst example am I? I believe we were talking about Christianity. If my 'examples' weren't good enough for you, then I apologize oh great one. I do believe that my examples tie in with Amby's first post. If they do not, please point out exactly where they are totally different.

I definately am not confused. If I were, you could have easily proven me wrong with your bible intellect, but since you have not, I will continue on believing I am "more right" than you.

 

I never said the Pope's actions represent Christianity. I'm saying what the church did, affect the way I look at Christianity now. If the Church hadn't done all those things it did, I could care less about Christianity and it would probably still be some backwater religion.

What does Rodman's hair style have any effect whatsoever on basketball anyways? You were talking about things the Pope actually did. Those are actions. If you want to make an analogy, please at least compare two similar things.

 

Like biscuitrat said, you're just repeating things. You're not supporting your claims with anything at all. You should at least sound like you know SOMETHING of a background of what you are defending. You just seem to be throwing anything out you can think of and attacking every word I say. You say that I twist your words, but you're being a hypocrite when you say that. To debate properly, you need substance.

[HoRuS 0]

Heh, I can only reply this to this topic:We were given the freedom of choice, that's why it is such a mess on this planet I once laid the Bible, the Koran and even the ancient Egyptian "Bible" next to each other and I saw that the cores are the same, just told difference. They all speak of ONE God, whether it's called God, Allah, Boeddha, Krisjna whatever...I'm sick of wars being held "in name of God", it's pathetic.My personal opinion is that God created ur lives as how it created everything what exists, so we can learn... Learn what? I dunno... But everything we do has consequences and we need to accept em, whether you believe or not.My faith is nothing like Christianity, Islam or any one faith else. My faith is based on things I see around me and based on religic elements from wich I think are correct. As far as I know there is no big man in the sky sitting on a throne and telling what will happen next .All I DO know is that everything I was told was a lie and that there is more then our mind can comprehend, I do hope more people will find out the truth for him- or herself and free the human race from this mental "slavery".Peace

[biscuitrat 0]

Exactly right! You may believe that you've been put on the planet for something, but you can only do so much with your life. None of us have the mentality of a messiah, no matter how humble we think we are. Most of us would die without technology or go into some weird hibernation from the lack of social contact that we would otherwise get from the internet. Would you give it all up to be revered/hated for a certain length of time or would you rather be yourself? I'm sure Jesus wanted his own life to live at certain points - that's why I like Dan Brown's version of his story. His Jesus marries and has somewhat his own views of his life...yeah, I'll get back on topic.I dislike holy wars because one man (a prophet, let's say) cannot be trusted to a certain extent. Would you kill your neighbors because your parents didn't like their religion? Would your neighbors kill you because your religions clashed? It's doubtful in the US, but in several shatter-belt regions, it happens all the time. It's a sad truth that humanity can't make up its mind for itself. With only a little influence, you can change the lives of several people that you may not even know. It's really horrifying at times. I especially like this part of your statement, Horus. Religion can be slavery and ignorance can be slavery. And don't we have rights as men and women of this earth to be free? (same with animals, I believe)Oh, and Horus. Krishna is merely an avatar of our chief god Vishnu. The trinity goes like this: Brahma - creator, Vishnu - nourisher/protector, Shiva - destroyer.