Heaven - The Last Station? Do you think that with heaven everything ends?

[heavensounds 0]

Well I have a lil' question for everyone...

 

Do you think (if you believe that you go to heaven someday), that after you go to heaven , you are happy and you will be there forever? Or are you comin' back to earth one day after all your good deeds will run out?

 

I mean if someone made 10 good deeds and the other one just 5 of them, they'd both go to heaven, but the one with 10 good deeds would be there longer! There we have another hierarchy which results in unhappiness!

 

This is not good at all my friend "I do good deeds to go to heaven one day" This is very wrong thinking IMO, because your good deeds and intentions are soon goin to run out and you'll go back to earth to achieve the realization that the problem always is YOURSELF. You want things and YOU are not satisfied with what you have...

 

The realization of how things are and calming our mind is more important than going to heaven as this will end one day!

 

BUT if you realize how things are, you ARE NEVER GOIN TO DO ANYTHING BAD AGAIN (and not for the sake of going to heaven, but because you'll KNOW that it is affecting your mind and your future - you will KNOW it is WRONG)

 

greetz

Edited March 18, 2006 by heavensounds (see edit history)

[truefusion 3]

Lol, i find that last sentence funny.But, you cannot come back down to Earth, after dying. You are, born again, but not by flesh and bones, but spiritually. Doing good deeds doesnt garruntee you a place in Heaven. Just cause you behaved better than the next guy doesnt mean you have a seat in Heaven. It could just mean your punishment in hell is far less greater than the next guy. But, to tell you the truth, everyone will see Heaven. But, whether you stay there or go to somewhere else, is a different story. But, this somewhere else isnt back down to Earth. Plus, why would you want to go back down to the area that's gonna no longer exist in the future?

Edited March 18, 2006 by truefusion (see edit history)

[oazisklub 0]

hello. This is a very good question. Maybe the Heaven it`s not the last station. I have a little bit interesting argument and apprehension, but if you think a little bit better: if every people goes up we will don`t have space. I know is a stupidity, but I have another one: wahat does our soul do there, so, OK we go up to heaven...and...wahat will be with us..I can`t imagein that. For me the most rational is the reincarnation. So...after death we will get a new life..so...maybe the persons reamin the same, only everybody get a new body. Alredy lot of peoples say that, and maybe this is sincer thing.

[truefusion 3]

hello. This is a very good question. Maybe the Heaven it`s not the last station. I have a little bit interesting argument and apprehension, but if you think a little bit better: if every people goes up we will don`t have space. I know is a stupidity, but I have another one: wahat does our soul do there, so, OK we go up to heaven...and...wahat will be with us..I can`t imagein that.
For me the most rational is the reincarnation. So...after death we will get a new life..so...maybe the persons reamin the same, only everybody get a new body. Alredy lot of peoples say that, and maybe this is sincer thing.

As in "we won't have space", you mean Heaven will become full? Even the earth can hold us all. Imagine how many Heaven can hold, and for that matter, hell. As for your other one, implying that IF we do get into Heaven, what would we do? Well, we'll love each other, but most of all God. We wouldnt have to worry about evil, and we wont remember about evil/sin, either. Everything would be perfect, after God recreates everything, though.

You're right to say we'll get a new life, but we wont get a new body, if you are reffering to flesh and bones, what we are now.

[BordaForx 0]

Considering what I believe, yes, we will stay in heaven. There are no such things as, "I made 10 good deeds, so I stay in heaven for 10 years"! That's just crazy. What you should think is: be good to the best of your ability, and help people and not yourselves. And, if you do do something bad, repent (ask for forgiveness) and never, ever make that mistake again. I know for a fact, that all of you have done something you have regretted. Trust me, you won't just "run out of" good deeds, so you will be back in earth again.

[no9t9 0]

This is how I envision the "afterlife" or "heaven"...Quite simply heaven is on earth... and so is hell. Everyone has a different life and for some, they are happy and have everything they want... they have a spiritually fulfilling life, a life full of love, etc. This person would be in "heaven". Then, there are other people on earth who are in "hell" because they have nothing. They are alone, they are sad and depressed, and more.Now, here is the tricky part. Who gets the good life and the crappy life? This depends on how you have lived your previous life. You live and do good deads, you die and get rewarded by reincarnating into a better life. IF you do bad deeds, you die and your next life will be a bad one.

[truefusion 3]

This is how I envision the "afterlife" or "heaven"...
Quite simply heaven is on earth... and so is hell. Everyone has a different life and for some, they are happy and have everything they want... they have a spiritually fulfilling life, a life full of love, etc. This person would be in "heaven".

Then, there are other people on earth who are in "hell" because they have nothing. They are alone, they are sad and depressed, and more.

Now, here is the tricky part. Who gets the good life and the crappy life? This depends on how you have lived your previous life. You live and do good deads, you die and get rewarded by reincarnating into a better life. IF you do bad deeds, you die and your next life will be a bad one.

Your reward in Heaven depends on how many good deeds you did. Your punishment in hell depends on how many bad deeds you did. If Heaven and hell are both in the same place, that would mean i could walk to hell, from Heaven. That would mean, I'm sending myself to be punished. And if some spirit would get free from the clutches of hell, they would run to Heaven. As you can see, this would be cheating the afterlife.

[no9t9 0]

Your reward in Heaven depends on how many good deeds you did. Your punishment in hell depends on how many bad deeds you did. If Heaven and hell are both in the same place, that would mean i could walk to hell, from Heaven. That would mean, I'm sending myself to be punished. And if some spirit would get free from the clutches of hell, they would run to Heaven. As you can see, this would be cheating the afterlife.

I don't think you understand. It is all about perspective. What is heaven to one person may be hell to another. You have to open your mind so you get past your heaven/hell paradigm. If you are in "hell" (which is on earth), let's say you are depressed and have nothing... You have a bad life. Now, how can you "walk over to heaven"? The only way to do that is to change your life. To change your life, you must do good deeds and work hard to improve yourself. If you can do this, you deserve to be in heaven. And since you DID do this, you WILL be in heaven because now your life has changed. Hence, the "reincarnation" to a "new" life.

Now, "walking to hell" and "sending yourself to be punished". If you have a good life and are happy, it can be said you are in "heaven". You decide to kill someone... your bad deed will be punished... by jail, guilt, etc. You will have lost your "place" in heaven and will have now "walked" to hell.

[anwiii 17]

I don't think you understand. It is all about perspective. What is heaven to one person may be hell to another. You have to open your mind so you get past your heaven/hell paradigm. If you are in "hell" (which is on earth), let's say you are depressed and have nothing... You have a bad life. Now, how can you "walk over to heaven"? The only way to do that is to change your life. To change your life, you must do good deeds and work hard to improve yourself. If you can do this, you deserve to be in heaven. And since you DID do this, you WILL be in heaven because now your life has changed. Hence, the "reincarnation" to a "new" life.
Now, "walking to hell" and "sending yourself to be punished". If you have a good life and are happy, it can be said you are in "heaven". You decide to kill someone... your bad deed will be punished... by jail, guilt, etc. You will have lost your "place" in heaven and will have now "walked" to hell.

interesting topic and your response was the only that made most sense to me....now on to my belief

to go with what was quoted, i believe life is a learning experience. you learn as much as you can before you die. "heaven" and "hell" IS a matter of perspective after you die. those who have failed to learn and achieve what they were born to do will have a harder time sifting through after life before being born again. your soul and spirit will ALWAYS live on as as energy(positive or negative). after you die, you have more learning experiences to go through before being born again in to another host with another purpose, or the same purpose if you decide not to learn a thing, live in regret or end your life by your own hands prematurly. now comes my sick sense of belief. since i believe life is a learning experience, i also believe, you can't learn if the world is perfect. so i believe there must be negative energy at all times in order to grow and learn from. negative and positive energy is supposed to balance out through learning experiences. those who say "life is crap" have a lot to learn because life IS a matter of perspective. for every negative situation, something positive can come out of it if you look at it the right way. the more you learn in this life time, the more your spirit and soul grows. life never gets easier. what gets easier is how you deal with what comes your way. and when you die, all this will be taken in to consideration....whether you have to relive your same life with similar situations until you learn, or go on to the next level of existance with a whole new set of experiences. the term "old soul" comes from one who has lived many lifetimes and experiences. some say if your life is hell on earth, you will live through hell in the afterlife until your soul grows to be reborn again. i tend to agree somewhat to that theory although i don't believe in "heaven" or "hell" as stated in the bible. it's not based on good OR bad deeds, but based on learning experiences although if you know why you were born and are capable of living that life, chances are you are a step ahead of the rest. unselfish deeds are good but are for not if they don't benefit who you are to help you grow as a person. some say that those who commit suicide will live in limbo by reliving their suicide for a long time after they die. i tend to agree with that as i believe life after death is also a learning experience until you are ready to be reborn. and if you made mistakes that you failed to fix before you die, there has to be some form of learning experience so that when you are reborn, you are less capable of making the same mistakes.

as far as me specifically, i know i am here for a reason. i feel i know the reason. i know i will live a long life to guide others or i would have already been dead by now with my multiple near death experiences. i believe people have come in to my life for eithr a short or long time that guided me(without knowing it sometimes) to help me grow and learn. although i believe if i were to die at an early age, it would have been meant to help another lost soul learn from my own death. i don't believe that's in my future though since i know i am capable of helping alot more than just 1 or 2 in my lifetime.

now these are my general beliefs and knowledge coming from personal exepriences and those beliefs coming from others that i incorporated in to my own.

i do believe religion is over rated and for those who are insecure and need something in their life so their life makes more sense. religion is for followers in my opinion. because i believe we are all unique and different and have something unique and different to offer in to this world, to be a follower is always a wrong path to take in ones life. i believe all religions speak one form of truth or another, but not one will speak the whole truth and one needs to take all knowledge and experience in to incorporate one strong belief that you can call your own for YOU.

now if all else fails and you still don't know what path, always live life with good morals and values, treat others as you want to be treated(which i guess is still fairly relative) and don't hurt others in a negative way("hurt" and "negative" may seem redundant, but it's not if think long and hard on it) and you have a better chance of happiness in the afterlife and a shorter time in the afterlife to be reborn again.

Now, "walking to hell" and "sending yourself to be punished". If you have a good life and are happy, it can be said you are in "heaven". You decide to kill someone... your bad deed will be punished... by jail, guilt, etc. You will have lost your "place" in heaven and will have now "walked" to hell.

what i didn't agree with is the jail comment. since life to me is learning experiences, someone going to jail either means they made a mistake or the justice system was screwed up. we are all meant to make mistakes to learn from so we don't make the same mistakes. jail is a great place to turn your life around and other peoples lives around sicne jail is mostly of people who lost their way, make up for your own by helping others to find it. this would not be considered hell, but considered a right path for many who find themselves in this situation and can be a very very positive experience. there is no hell or heaven on earth. there is only "what is" and what you do with it and your own perspective. sometimes there is no right or wrong because everyone was meant to lead a different life

[wild20 0]

Whoa guys! You are really taking this to the top! Hey, how about some clarifying? The Bible says what is going on. First, you can't earn your way to heaven. The Bible says it is a free gift. And not by works, lest one of us should decide to boast We are there for the same amount of time. And we do come back to Earth. God after the destruction of the world, will bring us back to this barren planet and heaven too! Then He will start anew, making everything all over again.On this other stuff, you are really talking about works. Explaining it works great, if you can do it right. It is simple. Believe on Jesus Christ, and you will be saved. But you see it goes a little farther. You are saved through faith and grace. But faith and grace without works is dead. It is like this. You promise your boss to straighten up and be good, but don't do anything after he tells you he forgives you. See? Hope this clears things up. A little.

[heavensounds 0]

I am very happy to see that there are so many answers to this topic...I read all of this and here is what i can say after all that...

 

All of you ppl are suggesting that there is still this "I" "self" in heaven or in hell....Well the thing is as long as this " I " will remain, you cannot be happy, cos' you'll always want something more - there is NO such thing that would make your EGO happy permanently!! If you know one..please let me know and I'll be more than happy to give it a try....I PERSONALY DON'T LIKE PROMISES LIKE: "In heaven all will be great and we'll all love each other" I like proofs and proofs are the daily life we live in...JUST OPEN YOUR EYES AND SEE!!

 

Well the major probelm IS OUR "I" "MYSELF" "EGO" or whatever you name it, THAT MAKES IT IMPOSSIBLE FOR US TO SEE THINGS JUST AS THEY ARE...

 

Let's think that way - IF WE ARE NOT ATTACHED TO THIS "I" and DO NOT ATTACH OURSELVES TO ANYTHING ELSE - AREN'T WE TRULY HAPPY THEN???

 

This is called NIRVANA and it goes BEYOND HEAVEN, because it includes no such thing as "I" - you realize that you are one with everything - AND YOU CAN ONLY ACHIEVE THAT ON EARTH as a HUMAN BEING (this is why sucidie is totally wrong imo)

 

"I" is just an empty cup, thats making it impossible for us to see that we are ONE WITH EVERYTHING AROUND US!! JUST BREAK THE CUP!!

 

IF YOU ARE UNATTACHED TO THINGS and SEE THINGS AS THEY ARE, YOU ARE HAPPY RIGHT HERE & RIGHT NOW! There is no need to go somewhere, because nowhere - even in heaven will you be trully happy, cos' your EGO will NEVER STOP WISHING FOR THINGS AND THAN ATTACH TO THEM --->

 

--> And this is the cause of all our suffering!

 

Think about it and please reply...

 

greetz

Edited March 29, 2006 by heavensounds (see edit history)

[truefusion 3]

Heh, i have trouble understanding you, especially with all this "I" thing... But, one shouldn't be materialistic. And you cant be permanently happy on earth. I've felt true happiness. Infact, it lasted for a whole day. Straight from when i got out of bed, to when i went back to bed. Nothing could have ruined that day. That was on the day after i repented. Something tells me, I'll receive such happiness again, and it'll be permanent the next time. But, not on earth. And if that's the feeling I'll get in Heaven, then that's where i'll strive to go to. As for nirvana, it's not permanent. You'll eventually snap out of it.

[heavensounds 0]

Well the problem is that, that day of yours and everyone elses ends at some point - constant fullfilment and pleasure is not possible with longing for material or psihical enjoments!

 

As you said that you'll eventually snap out of nirvana ) That is kind of funny, because the whole point of nirvana is that when you see things celarly as they are, your ego does not exist anymore - there is only happines and what is there left to snap out??

 

For example:

 

Your ego is an empty cup filled with air....that cup is your ego and it is preventing your real self to find its way out of this LIMITATIONS (these limitations are your ego) of this cup....if you realize how things really are, you brake this cup and when that happens you are one with that air outside the cup! This is why there is no turning back - the ego is gone...and that means pure happines!

 

BUT as I should have added earlier...

 

there are many ways to the top of the mountain and each and everyone of them leads to the top!

 

We'll all reach the top and realize the truth one day...but everyone has his own path!

 

greetz