Need More Dog Grooming Advice... Sheepdog??

[rob86 2]

I seem to have missed our resident sheepdog's barrage of dog related topics by mere minutes, but anyway I need a refresher course on dog grooming. It's shedding time again and I'm in need of some help or emotional support (Ack, so much fur flying!!)

 

I said a lot of this last time I posted about dog grooming, but I'll say it again..

 

Here is my dog, a Border Collie with a medium length rough coat (I guess) :

 

Not a current picture. He's shedding a lot now..

 

I have these equipment:

 

 

 

I can't seem to make any progress brushing my dog during shedding season. I use the under coat rake, and after hours of "raking" his back I still get big clumps of under coat fur. How long is it supposed to take? Am I supposed to keep going until no more clumps of fur come out with the rake, or should I just move on to another type of brush?

 

Should I be using the rake all over my dog's body or just his back/sides? Not surprisingly, he doesn't seem to like his furry butt raked. His butt is in serious need of brushing, but I'm not sure how to tackle it. His butt area is definitely the most frustrating area to brush for both me and the dog and also the most in need of attention. It always gets tangles. I guess his obsession with swimming only makes the tangles worse..

 

Should I be doing small areas at a time, or brush the entire length of the dog in one long sweep?

 

Also.. I read that you're supposed to either brush backwards (against the fur direction) or use some kind of spiral motion. Huh? Am I supposed to be doing this? I gave it a try and my dog didn't seem to mind, but it seems weird.

 

Do I need more grooming equipment? I think some kind of a heavy duty comb would be useful to get tangles out. I'm also wondering if the brushes shaped like a glove might be a more comfortable experience for my dog or is it the same thing as what I already have? I find the brush I have in the picture a little too... rough? It doesn't seem to work as good as a regular soft squishy hair brush on the tail, which I often find myself using instead of the dog brush. My dog seems less bothered by a softer brush on his tail.

 

I was interested in what they call a "Slicker Brush"

 

 

I was reading about grooming and I saw some people use this brush a lot? Should I be using this instead of the "Grooming Brush" I posted up there? Is it good for the whole body or mainly for sensitive areas like the belly?

 

Well, lots of questions...

Edited May 13, 2011 by rob86 (see edit history)

[sheepdog 10]

Sorry I missed you. But I'm sure you still have fur flying, it takes awhile to get it all loose during the spring shedding season.I think your tools are probably sufficient for the job, though a good metal comb might be nice for finishing off after you get the bulk of the hair removed. If he doesn't have too many clumps or tags already forming in his fur. Then a matt splitter would probably work better. It is a very handy tool, it has tines that look like a searated knife blade that cut threw the clumping hair and let's you get them out and still leave the long coat. For your dog, forget the pin (slicker) brush. You would spend as much time getting all that hair out of the brush as you would spend getting it out of the dog. One swipe over the dog and you'd have to pick the pin brush. They are ok for fluffing up little poodles when you are drying them, but not much else. And hit the ends of your fingers with one and you will figure out real quick that they are not very comfortable against your skin. There is a metal tooth brush that looks like a regular human hair brush that might be helpful, try to find one that has rounded tips, they are fairly comfortable against the skin. Those grooming gloves look like a smart idea, but they are difficult to keep on your hands, when you hit a thick spot your hand just seems to pop right out of them. I do cheat a bit on my grooming, I like to shave a spot completely down to the hide just at the base of the tail, straight down over the butt and down the back of the leg, sometimes taking a little off on the underside of the leg too. This gives me a starting point on the back side, where the hair is gone and I can slowly start brushing into the heavy hair, I usually just brush out 1/2 an inch at a time and move over slowly as the hair thins in the area I'm working in. Brush in the direction the hair is laying. You can, once you get the bulk of the hair out, brush against the grain, to sort of fluff it up so you make sure you are getting all the way to the skin. Getting to the skin is important, I've seen dogs with coats you could easily run a comb threw the top layer and they look just perfectly slick, but they still have a matted undercoat. Since you don't have clippers, try finding the spot on the back of the leg where the shorter leg hair starts and the longer hair of the upper leg and body just ends. Pull down just a bit at a time, slowly working your way up the leg. You can also start possibly, in the flank area, and work back slowly over the hips. Every breed of dog I know of has that extra heavy hair over the hips and down the back legs. Their front end looks perfectly smooth and groomed and their butts look terrible. Clumps everwhere. Work into these, as I said, slowly, just part way threw the thick stuff. Once the hair is well seperated, you can take full width brush strokes, but it's easier when you are starting out to take it in small strokes. Swimming definatly makes the matts harder to get out. For some reason, water makes the matts harder and more dense. You should always brush out your pet before bathing. I know all too well what a daunting task this can be this time of year. That dang hair just seems to keep coming and coming out. Since you have a border collie, and they are not well known for sitting still for any great lenght of time, it's probably best to groom in short sessions. Maybe 10 minutes or so at a time. Give him a treat if he behaves well after you finish. If he knows's a treat is coming, he will probably be more cooperative during the grooming sessions. Just keep the faith, it will all eventually come out!And thanks Anwii, for letting me know there was a question right up my alley! I tried to answer your message and for some reason I couldn't get in to answer it.

[sheepdog 10]

I don't think I did a real good job of describing the matt splitter, so I too a quick picture of the 2 different forms I have. I prefer the red handled one, but as you can probably see, I've used the blue one enough to break out 2 teeth and pull off the outer handle. Good quality grooming tools are hard to come by unless you are willing to spend big bucks. I've seen scissors in grooming catalogs for over $100!!! Cold day in hell before I ever spend $100 on a pair. But I have thought long and hard about coughing up $30 or $40 for what they call a Mars Coat King. I think they would be real handy, but since they come in several sizes, it would cost a small fortune to get them all.

[anwiii 17]

what i like to do right before summer is shave my dog down to the skin. not only will that get rid if the fur problem for a few months, it gets hot and your dog will love ya for it. the only problem is, for the first month or so, your dog will not look too pretty :)it's a give and take thing, but that's what i personally like to do. also, all my dogs liked to swim in the pool and sheepdog is right. it creates a denser matt and by just shaving your dog, you wont have to worry about combing through that crap.this year was strange for my dog because i could spend 15 minutes combing through the hair and STILL have hair that comes up.

[sheepdog 10]

Yes, that is actually what I do the the vast majority of my dogs. I just shave them down, right to the hide and am done with it. There are a lot of advantage to this method. One, as you say it is cooler for the dog. It prevents a host of skin problems, like hot spots from ever getting started. Air circulation and some sunshine is vital for healthy skin. I don't think very many people realize how good of a disinfectant sunshine actually is. Another benefit is if you do happen to get an external parasite problem, fleas, ticks, lice, etc, it is far more effective to treat the dog if you don't have all that hair for the pesky little varmits to hide in. Then there is of course, the fact that mine are breeding dogs. All that hair can harbor lots of disease causing organisims, not only bacteia, but funguses and yeasts that can have a detrimental effect on the incomplete immune system of young pups. Adult dogs have long developed immune systems that these bacteria are not likely to be a problem for the adults, but pups that have not yet been exposed to them are often quite suseptable. Did you know that one gram of feces can contain one million disease causing bacteria? A gram is such a tiny ammount, it could easily stick that much in the excess hair around the rectum. One real big advantage to the lack of hair is the fact that I can assess the body condition of the dog at a glance. If a dog needs to gain weight, or loose weight, I can spot problems instantly. Long hair can really cover up any problems and make it more difficult to catch them before any real damage is done. I have heard it said that you shouldn't shave a dog down as the hair acts as insulation against the heat, but I'm betting anybody that ever said that never tried to wear a fur coat in July!

[Indego_Media 1]

We do the same with all the non show dogs, especially the older kids.... we clip them each year around mid spring so that they can enjoy the warmer months and not stress too much in the heat also cuts down on the amount of hair that you have to clean up each day.As we have long hair breeds the grooming is an on going thing and coast change is just simply hell, but its what you do if you want to keep show dogs...BTW we just got the papers to say that our new boy is all clear to be inported to AUS next month, it won't happen quick enough.

[sheepdog 10]

OH, keeping one in show coat can be nearly a full time job in some breeds! Poodles, Sheepdogs, and many other breeds have very difficult to maintain show coats. I would hate to even try to keep one in show coat. I've tried to work over a lot of mine to keep them in coat long enough to take nice pictures of my adults and let me tell you, that is really a job! Especially about the time the hair is almost long enough to look good, and then it's a race to get that last little bit grown out while you can still keep up with the brushing. How long is the quaranteen period where you are? Austrailia? What kind of dog are you getting?

[Indego_Media 1]

How long is the quaranteen period where you are? Austrailia? What kind of dog are you getting?

We have been breeding Cavalier King Charles Spaniels for the past 9 years and in the past 9months we've moved into the Havanese breed, Our new boy is a Havanese, great bloodlines and all going well he'll be a Canadian Champion before he leaves to come over to Aus. The Quananteen period here is 30 days from arrival but he has had to have all of the tida tests and usual stuff done and been clear in Canada for the past 5 months. so all up its a 6 month delay before we actually get him, He will be our 4th import.

It costs me a small fortune everytime my partner decides we need new blood...... But I wouldn't have it any other way

The cavies are fairly easy to groom but the havanese are a full time job. they need to be brushed everyday, they have a silk like cost that doesn't malt, so the only time they loose coat is between 6 - 12 months when they go through coat change and then you need to physically drag out all the old coat over the period so that the new coat can grow through and so that the old coat doesnt knot and matt up.... its a huge job and can be very time consuming but its what you do if you want show dogs.....

[sheepdog 10]

Ah....Cavalier King Charles Spaniels, great little dogs. Nice easy going personalities, get along well with everything and everyone, don't tear things up, and not too hard to groom. Wish I could get excited about them. I'm just a terrier person. For some reason the whimpy type dogs just don't get it for me. (although I do have some Japanese Chins) My vet raised the CKCS for many years, he had some really nice ones, good patella's, hearts, and no hernias! They are a popular breed, and make a nice pet for the average owner that may be too challenged by some of the more intense breeds.I like the looks of the Havanese, but am not real familiar with them. Anyway, I am trying to learn to like breeds that don't have all that dog gone hair to deal with. Not having much luck in that department though. Every spring I cuss myself for liking all these hairy breeds. I have imported 4 dogs too, mine all came threw Europuppy, and I have to say, I got some really great dogs from them. Standard Schnauzers, and Welsh Terriers, all champion sired and dams. Great dogs, and actually I was able to get them threw him at a better price than getting them from a breeder here in the states, if I could even find a breeder that would sell me one. I may not do much showing myself, but I like to see some red in those pedigrees to preserve the breed type and quality.

[Indego_Media 1]

Hmmm i wish my cav's had read the same breed standard that you know about.... My lounge may be still intact if they didn't distroy it I do love them, I know what you mean about wimpy dogs, I used to have collies and rotties, but when I moved out of home I couldn't take them with me so these days my partner and I are happy with the smaller breeds, But I have a soft spot for BIG dogs, Afgahns and most of the Larger Spaniels are just fine.My Partner refuses to get an Afgahn as the grooming would kill us...... He does most of the grooming and Showing. He's very passionate about it all. Has a trick for just about every coat type and has spent many hours and hundreds of dollars working on getting the right mix of product and technique to get the coats the way that he wants them for show...... Keep at it with search for a breeder who will let you have some new lines I'm sure you will find one, good luck with the breeding program, Its hard work and made even harder when some breeders don't test or advise what issues they have in thier lines....

[sheepdog 10]

Oh, I'd love to get the chance to pick his brain sometimes on all that grooming knowledge! Just about everything I learned I've had to figure out myself, by experimenting and just doing it. I seriously started from scratch on the dog grooming stuff. Believe it or not, I learned to shear dogs by watching a sheep shearer do it! Now that's just about as far as you can get away from show grooming! Of course, I've come a long way since then, thank goodness. Show grooming truely is an art form. So many different styles and trick and things you need to know. I doubt I'll ever be really good at it, but at least I can get the dogs to look more or less like they are supposed to. Maybe you should read my post to your dogs? They are supposed to be good little guys and not go tearing up stuff.

[Indego_Media 1]

honestly my Cav's and Havanese are not too bad, its only when they get bored and that seems to happen in the winter when they are inside. the older ones curl up infront of the fire and the young ones seem to get into mischief. Touch Wood, they havent distroyed any furniture for a while now:) but puppies will be puppies.....