Are Vegetarians Smarter? Post Your Opinion....

[Misanthrope 0]

An average of an IQ 5 higher than meat-eaters doesn't seem much to me.

I suppose it's all a matter of prioriites, isn't it? If your idea of a good time is seeing how far you can throw a football accross a muddy field, than no, I suppose five IQ points wouldn't seem like much.

In the world of the learned, a single IQ point can mean the difference between attaining MENSA status or wallowing in mental obscurity.

My suspicion is, if you were smart enough to respond to a post on Vegetarianism, than five IQ points probably mean more to you than you'd like to admit.

Please keep checking back at this category and I'll have more on the subject. Until then, thank you for your input.

[sweetescape 0]

No, but they're slimmer, because a large study presented in the AJCN concludes that vegetarian women have a lower risk of obesity than omnivorous women. The study included 55,000 Swedish women and many different kinds of vegetarian diets - vegan, lacto, and semi-vegetarians.

Overall, vegans had the lowest average body mass index (BMI) -- a measure of weight in relation to height -- followed by vegetarians, then meat-eaters. While 40 percent of meat-eaters were overweight or obese, only 25 to 29 percent of vegetarians and vegans were, Newby and her colleagues report.

This research is fascinating in that it challenges the "carb debate". Does a vegetarian tend to eat more fibrous carbohydrates than refined carbohydrates? Surely the issue of saturated fat in red meat cannot be the only reason for the difference?

But, Vegetarianism might be healthy thanks to meal replacements like tofu and so on, but what about Vegans? I don't think it's that healthy... And for your question, it's vice-versa, it is that smart people become Vegetarians, not that Vegetarians become smart people.
Edited January 17, 2007 by sweetescape (see edit history)

[Misanthrope 0]

This research is fascinating in that it challenges the "carb debate". Does a vegetarian tend to eat more fibrous carbohydrates than refined carbohydrates? Surely the issue of saturated fat in red meat cannot be the only reason for the difference?

But, Vegetarianism might be healthy thanks to meal replacements like tofu and so on, but what about Vegans? I don't think it's that healthy... And for your question, it's vice-versa, it is that smart people become Vegetarians, not that Vegetarians become smart people.

Sweetscape! What a great handle...

Yes, it does throw a pie in the face of that whole carbohydrate scam, doesn't it? On a personal note, I am vegetarian and I'd say I probably consume more carbs that your average flesh eater. And still, I'm on the thin side and don't count calories. I do avoid anything white, i.e. refined. I also shy away from wheat because where I come from, unless it's organic, it's genetically modified. I also believe Americans tend to eat way too much of it, creating a saturation effect that manifests in disease and weight issues. When I want wheat I find certain varieties of beer to be the best source. Cheers!

On the issue of Veganism, I lived this lifestyle for several years and found it quite exhilarating. I went back to eating dairy and eggs due to pure hedonism and for the sake of convienience, not because my body felt it was missing out nutritionally.

I submit that people eat meat for the same reason. Not because they need "animal fat," but simply because they crave the taste. It's proven the human animal does not need meat; on the contrary, the human animal thrives without it. Therefore, it all comes down to hedonism.

[Yratorm, LightMage 0]

Hmm, I REALLY don't think the body cares where it's getting it's nutrition from. I think a vegan diet is fine for occupations where the body is not under severe physical stress - however, the tissue repair resulting from extreme stress on the muscles requires a complex set of substances that are not present in their entirety in most vegetable foods. An exception to this is soyabean, and one or two other foods. However, all meats contain the materials for tissue repair - so you see, it really is a most convenient source for people in high-muscle-stress professions.

 

You CAN get the same results from a vegan diet, but you would have to 'mix and match' the various constituents of your vegan meal so that ALL the necessary constituents required for tissue-repair were present in it TOGETHER, in a single meal. Not easy unless you're a nutritionist.

 

Well, I have a heavy-muscle-stress lifestyle, you could say, and meat is certainly a very useful way to reduce my pain - that's what it is, really. When you stress your body to extremes, you are in REAL muscular pain until your body's demands for repair materials is satisfied. And believe me, your body doesn't care where those materials come from. The pain ceases when it's demands are satisfied, and they are satisfied most easily by meat, second most easily by soyabean. I speak from extensive experience.

 

As for intelligence and it's relation to vegetarianism - I've already spoken on the subject, there's no point in repetition there.

[Misanthrope 0]

Hmm, I REALLY don't think the body cares where it's getting it's nutrition from. I think a vegan diet is fine for occupations where the body is not under severe physical stress - however, the tissue repair resulting from extreme stress on the muscles requires a complex set of substances that are not present in their entirety in most vegetable foods. An exception to this is soyabean, and one or two other foods. However, all meats contain the materials for tissue repair - so you see, it really is a most convenient source for people in high-muscle-stress professions.

 

You CAN get the same results from a vegan diet, but you would have to 'mix and match' the various constituents of your vegan meal so that ALL the necessary constituents required for tissue-repair were present in it TOGETHER, in a single meal. Not easy unless you're a nutritionist.

 

Well, I have a heavy-muscle-stress lifestyle, you could say, and meat is certainly a very useful way to reduce my pain - that's what it is, really. When you stress your body to extremes, you are in REAL muscular pain until your body's demands for repair materials is satisfied. And believe me, your body doesn't care where those materials come from. The pain ceases when it's demands are satisfied, and they are satisfied most easily by meat, second most easily by soyabean. I speak from extensive experience.

 

As for intelligence and it's relation to vegetarianism - I've already spoken on the subject, there's no point in repetition there.

 

Yratorm, my friend! Again, thank you for subimtting your personal and learned input.

 

The truth is, most of us ARE NOT putting our body through extreme, physical hardship. Even so, some of the world's top brass have chosen a vegan and/or vegetarian diet for the very reasons you describe you prefer to consume flesh. Performing artist, Madonna, chose to adopt a vegetarian diet after undergoing the rigours of the stage and touring life, but she also has a Kabalistic spirituality backing up her beliefs. Hers is physically intense stage show. She is in her 40's and has the body of an 18 year old.

 

In fact, I was a professional musician performing a solo act at the time I decided to adopt a vegan (not just vegetarian) lifestyle. To clarify for our readers, I did not consume animal products of any kind. I did not practice food combining of any sort. The hours of this profession were rigourous, and I was responsible for loading, hauling and unloading very heavy PA equipment, as well as managing the sound while on stage. I performed until 2am, and often later if at a casino - on my feet for most of the time strapped to a heavy Gibson guitar, with people literally blowing their smoke in my face. I was on the road a good portion of the time with limmited access to the kind of food I would have really preferred. At the end of the gig, I had to tear everything down and haul it out again. If there are any musicians out there reading this post, you know how physically intensive this line of work is. Anyway, my point is, I don't believe I could have withstood this sort of physical (and mental) activity had I been on the standard American, meat and potatoes diet. Leaving off the cheese and eggs also helped me on the road when I didn't have access to organic products.

 

 

Hmm, I REALLY don't think the body cares where it's getting it's nutrition from.

I believe the body is the temple of the holy spirit, and as such, is an extension of our innate godhood - that small spark that will grow if we give it half a chance. Therefore, I conclude it DOES care what we put in to it.

 

You live a somewhat idealistic life on the steppes of the Himalayan mountains, where you breathe fresh air and the meat you do consume has not been subject to hormones and antibiotics. You are free to pursue the lifestyle of your choice and practice your "Ninja," craft, as Ellen so eloquently puts it. Many readers, I suspect, wish they were in your situation.

 

Not everyone; however, is as willing to give of themself as you. To your credit, you have chosen to share the vast knowledge you've gained from your situation with the masses. And for that, we are all grateful.

 

I will go on the offense and say I would disagree on this, now the challenge I face is how to explain it .

 

It is true people are born to be smart or be veggie people but it's a genetics thing though. It not like they decided to become one, although some people do decided they want to leave life of the meat.

 

With India they leave a simple life in the sense they don't worry about have the best cat, house or all that crazy stuff. With India I think they are some of the brightest people in the world, when I had to do my Power Point presentation about computers, I learn that most of the math that we used today has come from India and heck you could say they set up the foundations of today's computer programming as well with all the math techniques they have discover/invented in the last 2000 years.

 

One example would be the Jaina mathematicians who invented the logarithms which is a primary language in computers. This happen in the year 200 and who would have thought they are the one's who made computer possible in terms of programming.

 

So you could say my argument it's not their eating style more like lifestyle and environment. They had lots of free time to think about stuff of science and math that we used today.

 

But how do you explain people like Stephan Hawking, I believe his meals consist of liquids and not solids(some one verify that). Or people who are handicapped and yet some weird and and yet awesome way are just as smart or even smarter then "normal" people.

 

But like haslip mention results from the 70's can't verify if it is true basically they would have to start from scratch, but instead of pick normal people they should hit hte whole spectrum with those who have disabilities and those who don't and those who are very smart or those who are average.

 

From my arguments if plausible debunk the idea that eating certain foods will make you smarter. Although I won't entirely disagree it could be possible but you need like scientific proof to change my mind about it. Or think more on the idea.

 

Um, I'm not sure how to respond to most of your post, but I would like to address the following statement:

you need like scientific proof to change my mind about it

For the record, this information is not a fabrication. It is the result of a SCIENTIFIC study, and the results are conclusive. According to the British Medical Journal, no less than 8,179 subjects were involved. That's a lot of people! The study was published in various medical journals, and recently brought to the fore via BBC news. Let me know if you'd like links to these sources. I'd be happy to oblige.

[BooZker 0]

I think this is a dumb study. First off 5 points. That's such a small margin when you do thousands. Next off there are studies for every view point. There are studies that say weed will kill you and others that its good for you. The cigarette companies tried to tell people for years they did now harm. If you could show us maybe 10 studies along with who did them and where, maybe i could believe it more.

[crayolabox 0]

I dont see any connection between IQ and Vegetarianism. You dont get smarter by what you eat. I mean, not literally. I personally dont feel comfortable with a vegetarian diet. An all veggies diet cant provide all the nutritional needs that the body requires, so I doubt that it can make you more intelligent. Yes, veggies are healthy and good for the body, but unfortunately, that's not all we need. We need protien too. But hey, I have nothing against vegetarians. No offense.

[Misanthrope 0]

I dont see any connection between IQ and Vegetarianism. You dont get smarter by what you eat. I mean, not literally. I personally dont feel comfortable with a vegetarian diet. An all veggies diet cant provide all the nutritional needs that the body requires, so I doubt that it can make you more intelligent. Yes, veggies are healthy and good for the body, but unfortunately, that's not all we need. We need protien too. But hey, I have nothing against vegetarians. No offense.

Hi Crayolabox, no offense taken. As I may have mentioned before, this study was done under scientific conditions involving more than 8,000 subjects, and the results were confirmed. That is, folks who chose and stuck with a vegetarian diet ended up having 5 IQ points over their meat-eating brethern after all was said and done.

That said, your comment about not necessarily getting smarter by what you eat has some validity, because the study did not go into any further depth than to simply measure dietary choices and IQ.

The vegetarian diet provides everything the body needs. Whole cultures (the Hindus of India for example) live out their entire lives on this diet quite healthily, thank you. The seventh day adventists of the United States live on average (don't quote me on this) 10 years beyond the national average, and suffer significantly less heart disease, cancer, and so forth. This diet often opens whole new worlds for afficiandos, who find themselves experimenting with ethnic foods they might never have discovered otherwise. Adding different textures, colors, and flavors to your diet is a good thing, and provides the body with the variety it craves and needs to operate at it's full potential.

As far as protein goes, Americans, in particular, tend to get too much of it. Have you personally met anyone suffering from protein deficiency? Neither have I. This myth of protein only being available in meat was convieniently perpetuated by the beef industry. Go figure.
Edited January 18, 2007 by vbritton (see edit history)

[cangor 0]

Well, I kinda doubt vegitarians are smarter, because all the vegitarians I know are, well, not completely there, so to speak. Plus I eat meat on a regular basis and my I.Q.'s something like 165. However, I think there is a link between diet and intelligence, and vegetarians are probably a bit more careful about what they eat - e.g. they don't eat junky fast food. I think that it is more important to simply eat a nice, balanced diet with lots of meats and veggies and little sugar and that's what'll really make the difference.Also, one of the smartest people I know is an ex-vegetarian, and she just stopped being vegetarian a few months ago. As far as I can tell, she's more active and maybe even more intelligent now than when she was vegetarian... Then again, that's just me, but, as she said, her brother's vegetarian and it hasn't done anything for him, so...

[SensibleWebmaster 0]

I don't know if there is much of a difference when it comes to intelligence and smartness when it comes to diet, as long as nutritional requirements are met, but my personal experience is that veg meals are far lighter on the stomach.I'm not much of a non-veg eater in any case, being born into a vegetarian family. Not that I avoid it, but if the choice is between veg nad non-veg..... the non-veg had better be cooked in a really mouth-watering way :PIf any thing, a difference I notice seems to be that the vegetarians are sharper, while the non-vegetarians seem to be bolder. This may not necessarily be due to the diet though. A lighter stomach, my perceptions of people, or cultural influences on both attitude and diet could also be the cause behind it.Can't say. I guess our bodies work best on whatever food we've been brought up on since childhood, as we adapt to using nutrients most effectively from that kind of food.As far as I'm concerned, I am unlikely to consciously restrict myslef to any kind of food, but that doesn't mean much either, since my last non-veg meal was eggs and it happened 2 months ago

[Misanthrope 0]

SensibleWebmaster! I couldn't help but be intrigued by your following statement:

If any thing, a difference I notice seems to be that the vegetarians are sharper.

I always feel like the rest of the world is moving in slow motion: like I have to somehow slow myself down -physically and mentally, to somewhow relate to the vast majority. Do you feel the same way when you abstain from eating dead animals?

I imagine some of that has to do with how much harder meat is to digest than other foods. I also put some credence in that old maxim, "You are what you eat," and I think people tend to take on the characteristics of the animals they consume. As an example, in America, where poeple eat a lot of beef, some are like cattle. Like cows, they become slow, dimwitted, very large.....and most importantly, very easy to lead to slaughter (I mean that figuratively). Easily deceived by their media and government, they are slow to recognize these entities as their true enemies. While taking to them, I often feel as if I'm looking into the eyes of herd animal and not those of human being.

Disclaimer: the cow parallel is merely an observation of SOME people I've come into contact with in the states, and not meant as a personal attack on any one individual reading this post. So please do not interpert it as such.
Edited January 19, 2007 by vbritton (see edit history)

[Kubi 0]

In America, where poeple eat a lot of beef, many are like cattle. Like cows, they become slow, dimwitted, very large.....and most importantly, very easy to lead to slaughter (I mean that figuratively). Easily deceived by their media and government, they are slow to recognize these entities as their true enemies. While taking to them, I often feel as if I'm looking into the eyes of herd animal and not those of human being.

Wow, I'm very offended by that remark. "Humans are like cows, slow and dimwitted". There are MANY very intellectual americans who do in fact eat....COWS. Humans eat animals because we need the protien to live. If we weren't meant to eat cows, why were they put on this earth? I may not be the smartest person alive, but I'm surely no dimwit.

Oh, yes, I do eat much meat by the way.

[Misanthrope 0]

Well, I kinda doubt vegitarians are smarter, because all the vegitarians I know are, well, not completely there, so to speak. Plus I eat meat on a regular basis and my I.Q.'s something like 165. However, I think there is a link between diet and intelligence, and vegetarians are probably a bit more careful about what they eat - e.g. they don't eat junky fast food. I think that it is more important to simply eat a nice, balanced diet with lots of meats and veggies and little sugar and that's what'll really make the difference.
Also, one of the smartest people I know is an ex-vegetarian, and she just stopped being vegetarian a few months ago. As far as I can tell, she's more active and maybe even more intelligent now than when she was vegetarian... Then again, that's just me, but, as she said, her brother's vegetarian and it hasn't done anything for him, so...

Cangor! What's a super-intelligent guy like you doing on this planet? Your IQ is literally higher than Albert Einstein's, who had a mere 160 IQ. I'm honored someone of your intelligence responded to my post.

Well, I'll give you the one about vegetarians not being "completely there." When the conversation turns tedious, I'm definitely somewhere else.

[Kubi 0]

Lets not forget the other side of the story here vbrit. Other members have opinions also. There are 2 sides to each story, we must acknowledge both. Seeing has how many of us have put time and effort into these posts.

[Saint_Michael 3]

SensibleWebmaster! I couldn't help but be intrigued by your following statement:
I always feel like the rest of the world is moving in slow motion: like I have to somehow slow myself down -physically and mentally, to somewhow relate to the vast majority. Do you feel the same way when you abstain from eating dead animals?

I imagine some of that has to do with how much harder meat is to digest than other foods. I also put some credence in that old maxim, "You are what you eat," and I think people tend to take on the characteristics of the animals they consume. In America, where poeple eat a lot of beef, many are like cattle. Like cows, they become slow, dimwitted, very large.....and most importantly, very easy to lead to slaughter (I mean that figuratively). Easily deceived by their media and government, they are slow to recognize these entities as their true enemies. While taking to them, I often feel as if I'm looking into the eyes of herd animal and not those of human being.

vbitton I am so intrigued by your post, to start off that your opinion and your entitled to it. However you are very very wrong in so many factors.

1-First I am an American.
2-I am not slow like a cow (referring to people being stupid).
3-I am pretty smart last I heard.
4-I don't believe in the media hype and yes our government has lied, anyone with a dull IQ can figure that out.
5.-I wouldn't believe the words of a men magazine with pictures with half naked women in it and beer jokes.
6.-The Americans (my friends)I know are not like cows either, heck even some of the members here are from the US and they are not like cows they are as smart or smarter then me.
7-Also people don't become fat either it's coded in their DNA it's called a slow metabolism, regardless if you exercise fat will still build up because of that.
8-I eat beef as well, however I don't eat it every 5 minutes.
9-A Small percentage of Americans even fit your opinion

Hopefully that clears some stuff up for your opinion about the American's

If any thing, a difference I notice seems to be that the vegetarians are sharper, while the non-vegetarians seem to be bolder. This may not necessarily be due to the diet though. A lighter stomach, my perceptions of people, or cultural influences on both attitude and diet could also be the cause behind it.

What about working it both ways? some people can be both, veggie and non-veggie, I know I can pick up o things pretty quick while some others take their time. I would say it's not the food that makes people this way more like the energy/chemicals the food produces when it is digested. Of course I am not a dietican either so thats just a guess as well.