Bad Relationship, Partner Trust & Cheating Cheating on your mates?

[msdeeva 0]

I don't have a religion, a religion is man trying to work His way to God.  I'm a Christian.  I follow what the Bible says, what Christ told me, and which you are clearly against.  Christ clearly says that any reason for divorce other then for fornication is committing adultery:

Umm...  you mean this???

Well, this is a very good passage for showing that we SHOULD judge people by their actions...  Are you SURE this is what you're thinking of?   

 

Because it would be highly ironic if so.  Here Paul is specifically stating that those in a lifestyle contrary to the Gospel are living in rebellion against God and as he says those that are within the Church are judged by them.  (verse 12)  The Bible in Basic English translation for verses 12 you might find easier to understand:

 

1 Corinthians 5:12 For it is no business of mine to be judging those who are outside; but it is yours to be judging those who are among you;

So you see my friend, while this passage is again vulnerable to the same critique I made earlier, of what is meant by "judging" (whether as condemnation or a simple moral evaluation) the passage clearly states that those that are within the Church are indeed to be judged in the sense that they can be not included in the Church so long as they continue living in active rebellion to Christ, unrepentant sin involving the aforementioned sins.  What you've effectively just done is led us to one of the best passages for evidence of why we SHOULD judge within the Church, and that is why I laughed

But did Henry know any consequences would follow of his choice?  Yes, strong feelings can exist, that can be simple lust, and he did end up sleeping with the woman, didn't he?  I still fail to see your point there.  *shrugs*

 

You are right that Catholocism and Christianity are drawn together, in that a lot of Christian saints have been persecuted by Catholocism as they were burned at the stake, murdered through horrible tortures during the Inquisition, turned out in the cold with their garments cut short to freeze to death, etc...  So yes, I'll grant you that, there is a connection in that the Catholic Church is more responsible for the deaths of Christians then any other institution in the world.

 

Well, good to hear you use a KJV I suppose.  *shrugs*

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You're hilarious. Did you read the same Corinthians I 5:12. In my version it states this:

 

What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church?  Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside.  "Expel the wicked man from among you.

"

 

That and the aformentioned is what I'm was talking about. Those outside the church, whether immorally, or those following a different religion, are not to be judged, by any man, but by God himself as stated in Corinthians I, Chapter 5, verse 12. ON the same token, that verse states that we are not to deal among those who are wicked. Which is understandable.

 

As far as King Henry VIII: yes he did know that he and his country would be excommunicated from the Catholic Church if he divorced his wife. Remember that since Catholics and Christians follow the same Bible, divorce is supposed to be illegal under God. He didn't care, he wanted what his "heart" wanted.

 

As far as Catholics killing more than Christians. Are you kidding me? How many Africans/African Americans were killed in the name of Christianity (um, did you forget the trans-Atlantic slave trade, The U.S. involvement in slavery?). You really need to review some history before you get into a historical debate with me. Try in upwards of 4 billion people, murdered, tortured and enslaved in the name of Christianity. Christianity was used to explain why slavery was just. Slaves were taught the Christian faith, and that a life of slavery was what God wanted. Black people were supposedly cursed according to the Bible, which justified their enslavement -- according to Christians of the day. So called reasons to justify slavery were found in the Bible and were propagated and these ideals are still being propagated today. So don't tell me that Catholics have killed more then Christians.

 

It's funny because you still haven't told me anything remotely disproving what has already be shown to be historical facts. If you have anything else to say, please do some research first.

[msdeeva 0]

Joshua,

 

Just in case you didn't understand the Bible reference above:

 

When I read that scripture, I interepret it to mean - I, being Christian, am not to judge those outside of the Christian Church, whether they are part of another religion, or they are morally bankrupt and not part of the Christian Church.

 

If you see something else within that scripture, let me know. In my previous arguments the above is exactly what I was trying to say.

 

Anyway, you still haven't provided me with any "proof" alluding to the supposed fact that pathogens can impregnate, or can go through, intact latex condoms/gloves. Being that I'm in the scientific field, I'm truly intrigued and would like to know why researchers and medical staff alike have been able to go this long without contracting disease through intact gloves.

 

Thanks.

[Joshua 0]

You're hilarious.  Did you read the same Corinthians I 5:12.  In my version it states this:

 

"

 

That and the aformentioned is what I'm was talking about.  Those outside the church, whether immorally, or those following a different religion, are not to be judged, by any man, but by God himself as stated in Corinthians I, Chapter 5, verse 12.  ON the same token, that verse states that we are not to deal among those who are wicked.  Which is understandable.

 

As far as King Henry VIII:  yes he did know that he and his country would be excommunicated from the Catholic Church if he divorced his wife.  Remember that since Catholics and Christians follow the same Bible, divorce is supposed to be illegal under God.  He didn't care, he wanted what his "heart" wanted.

 

As far as Catholics killing more than Christians. Are you kidding me?  How many Africans/African Americans were killed in the name of Christianity (um, did you forget the trans-Atlantic slave trade, The U.S. involvement in slavery?).  You really need to review some history before you get into a historical debate with me.  Try in upwards of 4 billion people, murdered, tortured and enslaved in the name of Christianity.  Christianity was used to explain why slavery was just.  Slaves were taught the Christian faith, and that a life of slavery was what God wanted.  Black people were supposedly cursed according to the Bible, which justified their enslavement -- according to Christians of the day.  So called reasons to justify slavery were found in the Bible and were propagated and these ideals are still being propagated today.  So don't tell me that Catholics have killed more then Christians. 

 

It's funny because you still haven't told me anything remotely disproving what has already be shown to be historical facts.  If you have anything else to say, please do some research first.

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You never did answer my question. Why did Christ say not to judge and also not to judge righteous judgement? There's a difference between judging within yourself concerning what's right and wrong (which Paul says to do-1 Corinthians 11:13) and judging as in condemning others, putting them down to show they're worse then you are. I think you're missing this crucial distinction and it's what I've been trying to get you to see.

 

You yourself admit that there is a judging within the Church to put away those not living rightly according to the Gospel yet are still failing to realize the ways in which the word "judge" is used here.

 

And no, Catholics and Christians don't follow the same Bible, the Catholic "bible" declares a lot of dead saints who basically bribed the RCC to get their names put in, as "saints"

 

Just because someone says they're a Christian, doesn't make them one, it isn't about demographics. If you hurt others then you are not fulfilling the Law (Romans 13:10) for love is the fulfilling of the Law because it doesn't harm others. Christ's great commandments were to love others. The Bible gives an example of Paul doing all in his power to have a slave freed, the Ethiopian eunuch was of African heritage obviously and one of the first Christians, the Bible never gave an excuse for slavery. The Catholic Church has not changed their ways in condoning slavery or in allowing torture, it still supports its actions in the Inquisition, and has never apologized for them.

 

Some of the most clearly supported facts I could give you about Hitler being backed by the Roman Catholic Church are those the RCC refuses to acknowledge, despite all the undisputable evidence. Would any evidence I could give you ever be enough if you will simply suppress it?

[Joshua 0]

Joshua,

 

Just in case you didn't understand the Bible reference above:

 

When I read that scripture, I interepret it to mean - I, being Christian, am not to judge those outside of the Christian Church, whether they are part of another religion, or they are morally  bankrupt and not part of the Christian Church. 

 

If you see something else within that scripture, let me know.  In my previous arguments the above is exactly what I was trying to say.

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My answer lies exactly in that use of the word "judge." Simply saying something is wrong is not judging. Here's an excellent explanation of it from:

 

http://powertochange.com/discover/faith/questionsaboutgod3/

 

Some people might question this, saying it is intolerant to think only one religion has things right. But this response shows a misunderstanding of what intolerance really is. Intolerance comes from the word "tolerate." To tolerate means to allow something, such as a belief, to exist even though we don't like it or agree with it. Tolerance does not mean never disagreeing with anybody. The word implies disagreement. True tolerance means allowing differing views to coexist without necessarily agreeing with them or claiming that all views are true. Therefore, we can hold that one view is true or better than other views without being intolerant. If we were truly intolerant, we would seek to silence other points of view. But merely engaging in persuasive conversation with someone you disagree with is not intolerance. We show more respect for each other when we take our religious claims seriously than when we clothe them in a patronizing cloak of relativism.

There is judging where you condemn someone to put them down, then you are making yourself a judge. A judge condemns or sentences. Simply saying something is right or wrong however according to the Bible so long as you're not doing it to punish someone is not judging, for it isn't a sentence.

 

If someone thinks they're perfect obviously it's crucial for them to know what God defines as sin and what the punishment for it is, but those are not our judgements, they are God's, and we don't have to be saying them to put someone down but simply to help them realize that we are all guilty.

 

You can give knowledge which shows us all guilty so no one is singled out, and yes, homosexuality is wrong, but so is adultery, so is hating another person, it's equated to murder. Judging is to say a person is so much more awful then yourself to give a judgement that puts them down. God only is perfect and thus can do that. That is different from simply saying we are all sinners and not beating around the bush about what God says is wrong.

 

Simply saying homosexuality is a sin is not judging someone, for it's God's judgement of what is wrong, and is not singling out anyone as worse. When saying such that's why it's essential to emphasize that we are all guilty of death for sinning and that as Christ said, there is none good but one, that is God, and all, including Mary, the pope, and the apostles, have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.

[msdeeva 0]

You never did answer my question.  Why did Christ say not to judge and also not to judge righteous judgement?  There's a difference between judging within yourself concerning what's right and wrong (which Paul says to do-1 Corinthians 11:13) and judging as in condemning others, putting them down to show they're worse then you are.  I think you're missing this crucial distinction and it's what I've been trying to get you to see. 

 

You yourself admit that there is a judging within the Church to put away those not living rightly according to the Gospel yet are still failing to realize the ways in which the word "judge" is used here. 

 

And no, Catholics and Christians don't follow the same Bible, the Catholic "bible" declares a lot of dead saints who basically bribed the RCC to get their names put in, as "saints"

 

Just because someone says they're a Christian, doesn't make them one, it isn't about demographics.  If you hurt others then you are not fulfilling the Law (Romans 13:10) for love is the fulfilling of the Law because it doesn't harm others.  Christ's great commandments were to love others.  The Bible gives an example of Paul doing all in his power to have a slave freed, the Ethiopian eunuch was of African heritage obviously and one of the first Christians, the Bible never gave an excuse for slavery.  The Catholic Church has not changed their ways in condoning slavery or in allowing torture, it still supports its actions in the Inquisition, and has never apologized for them. 

 

Some of the most clearly supported facts I could give you about Hitler being backed by the Roman Catholic Church are those the RCC refuses to acknowledge, despite all the undisputable evidence.  Would any evidence I could give you ever be enough if you will simply suppress it?

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See, you can tell that to someone who's racist and a supposed Christian until you're blue in the face, but since the Bible is subject to interpretation by so many people, what you see is not necessarily what they see. People will continue to believe what they believe to be true Christianity, and you aren't going to be able to convince them differenlty, and vice versa. When you speak of the murders of Black people under the guise of Christianity, I don't care how you spin it, you can't tell tje persecutors that they're not true Christians. They don't believe that, because what they found in the Bible tells them differently. Do you catch my drift.

 

The same can be said about the Catholics and the Inquisition and the Crusades. You say those were true Catholics, but isn't it possible, that some individuals somehow misinterpreted the Bible to justify what they wanted?

 

As far as the first Christians, we don't need to get into that, because I don't think you would like what I have to say. I will tell you one thing, whether you are informed of it or not -- Jesus was Black. So, it is no suprise to me that the Bible would not condone any murdering of Black people. I was just pointing out that many so-called Christians draw different conclusions and interpret the Bible differently.

 

On the judgement issue: I think I've said all I'm going to say. I do not judge those outside the Christian Church, okay. It's that simple.

[msdeeva 0]

I just saw your little comment on how I'm supposedly against the Bible.You are so funny and self-righteous aren't you. Show me something in the Bible that says you cannot divorce if your husband beats you and threatens your life.Better yet show me a verse that talks about the dinosaurs that lived thousands of years before man.FYI: Just becuase it wasn't mentioned in the Bible doesn't mean it didn't/doesn't exist.In addition, did you know that the Catholic Church and King James went through scribes and scriptures (that came from Eygpt no less,) and hand picked what they thought was best to be put in the Bible?Anyway, I don't know who you think you are to tell me that I'm not a Christian, and I don't follow God's path. Only God knows what is in my heart. You are only a man, and you need to remember that.

[Joshua 0]

See, you can tell that to someone who's racist and a supposed Christian until you're blue in the face, but since the Bible is subject to interpretation by so many people, what you see is not necessarily what they see.  People will continue to believe what they believe to be true Christianity, and you aren't going to be able to convince them differenlty, and vice versa.  When you speak of the murders of Black people under the guise of Christianity, I don't care how you spin it, you can't tell tje persecutors that they're not true Christians.  They don't believe that, because what they found in the Bible tells them differently.  Do you catch my drift. 

 

The same can be said about the Catholics and the Inquisition and the Crusades.  You say those were true Catholics, but isn't it possible, that some individuals somehow misinterpreted the Bible to justify what they wanted?

 

As far as the first Christians, we don't need to get into that, because I don't think you would like what I have to say.  I will tell you one thing, whether you are informed of it or not -- Jesus was Black.  So, it is no suprise to me that the Bible would not condone any murdering of Black people.  I was just pointing out that many so-called Christians draw different conclusions and interpret the Bible differently.

 

On the judgement issue:  I think I've said all I'm going to say.  I do not judge those outside the Christian Church, okay.  It's that simple.

175666[/snapback]

I would say that rather the Bible is subject to misinterpretation, as is any great work of literature. All it takes is a little willful ignorance and deaf ears to shape or suppress things according to your desires. Just because others can misinterpret something does not mean the message is not usually crystal clear.

 

Hmm... since Christ was a Jew it was probably olive skin coloring, and a few years as a child in Egypt probably wouldn't have changed the skin sufficiently, but that's beside the point.

 

I still think you're misunderstanding the meaning of the word "judge" but if you don't want to talk about it, as you wish.

[Joshua 0]

I just saw your little comment on how I'm supposedly against the Bible.

 

You are so funny and self-righteous aren't you.  Show me something in the Bible that says you cannot divorce if your husband beats you and threatens your life.

 

Better yet show me a verse that talks about the dinosaurs that lived thousands of years before man.

 

FYI:  Just becuase it wasn't mentioned in the Bible doesn't mean it didn't/doesn't exist.

 

In addition, did you know that the Catholic Church and King James went through scribes and scriptures (that came from Eygpt no less,) and hand picked what they thought was best to be put in the Bible?

 

Anyway, I don't know who you think you are to tell me that I'm not a Christian, and I don't follow God's path.  Only God knows what is in my heart.  You are only a man, and you need to remember that.

175670[/snapback]

Alright, I'll show it to you a third time... Last time though!

 

Matthew 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

Christ specifically states that IF YOU DIVORCE OTHER THEN FOR FORNICATION YOU COMMIT ADULTERY. Plain and simple.

 

As for the dinosaurs, I could go into the behemoth and the great creatures to walk the earth, but I'd like to go into the Leviathan for now Read Job chapter 41, in verses 19-21 it even speaks of it being able to breath fire, so apparently the dragon legends are based on this very real dinosaur, which is probably where plesiosaur skeletons come from. In verses 15-16 it says the leviathan has airtight scales and in verses 31-32 that he dwells in the deeps of the sea. I can go further, but 41 should give you a lot of what you can learn about this creature. By the way, according to several verses I can give you, it would seem it will dwell in the depths of the ocean until the final day of judgement, meaning it's still around.

 

The key to finding eternal life is trusting in Jesus Christ alone to save us, not Mary, the pope, or anyone else. If any were sinless they could have died on the cross instead of God's perfect Son, but they weren't. We also CANNOT earn our way to Heaven, if you think you can you're not trusting in Christ's payment alone to save you. I will happily show you out of the Scriptures where any of the major Catholic doctrines are wrong.

[msdeeva 0]

I would say that rather the Bible is subject to misinterpretation, as is any great work of literature.  All it takes is a little willful ignorance and deaf ears to shape or suppress things according to your desires.  Just because others can misinterpret something does not mean the message is not usually crystal clear. 

 

Hmm...  since Christ was a Jew it was probably olive skin coloring, and a few years as a child in Egypt probably wouldn't have changed the skin sufficiently, but that's beside the point. 

 

I still think you're misunderstanding the meaning of the word "judge" but if you don't want to talk about it, as you wish.

175671[/snapback]

You know what, I figure since you don't want to expound on the "latex" issue, why should be continue to disagree about whether or not we are allowed to judge those outside of the Church even though it's stated in Corinthians I 5:12?

 

On the topic of misinterpretation: I would like to know why you don't think Catholics didn't misinterpret the Bible during the Inquisition. I would also like to know, what makes you the end-all-to-be-all interpreter. How do you know that you haven't misinterpreted scriptures as well? After all, we are all only human, and the Bible states that although the main message will remain intact, the Book itself will be revised/changed/interpreted by man, and there will be error.

 

You can think that Christ had olive skin all you want, if it helps you. I'm not going to argue on this. You can search the scriptures if you want, because I'm not wasting my time explaining how. Just as an FYI, though, the first Jews were Black. That should give you a start. Heck, the first people on earth were African. And if you argue this, I will point you toward a African history class taught by a white man at UCLA, and/or the Discovery channel to get you started on that.

 

[msdeeva 0]

Alright, I'll show it to you a third time...  Last time though! 

Christ specifically states that IF YOU DIVORCE OTHER THEN FOR FORNICATION YOU COMMIT ADULTERY.  Plain and simple. 

 

As for the dinosaurs, I could go into the behemoth and the great creatures to walk the earth, but I'd like to go into the Leviathan for now   Read Job chapter 41, in verses 19-21 it even speaks of it being able to breath fire, so apparently the dragon legends are based on this very real dinosaur, which is probably where plesiosaur skeletons come from.  In verses 15-16 it says the leviathan has airtight scales and in verses 31-32 that he dwells in the deeps of the sea.  I can go further, but 41 should give you a lot of what you can learn about this creature.  By the way, according to several verses I can give you, it would seem it will dwell in the depths of the ocean until the final day of judgement, meaning it's still around.

 

The key to finding eternal life is trusting in Jesus Christ alone to save us, not Mary, the pope, or anyone else.  If any were sinless they could have died on the cross instead of God's perfect Son, but they weren't.  We also CANNOT earn our way to Heaven, if you think you can you're not trusting in Christ's payment alone to save you.  I will happily show you out of the Scriptures where any of the major Catholic doctrines are wrong.

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So are you saying that said Behemoths existed along side humans? Could it be possible that these behemoths are something different. In addition, where does the Bible talk about galaxies, planets, etc. Point me toward those scriptures. I suspect that they aren't there, but I could be wrong. If they aren't there, I am not suprised.

 

On the Catholic references: I'm not Catholic, so you don't have to convince me of anything. I was just simply pointing out the fact that they created the King James Bible and use it. So obviously they're seeing something you don't and vice versa. I don't get the praying to the saints thing myself. So you don't have to convince me.

[msdeeva 0]

As far as the divorce thing goes:As I've said before, King James revised the Bible and pick and chose which scriptures were to be included. He was but a man, and could have just as easily interjected his own ideals into it.I know in my heart that God would not allow a woman to stay in a violent marriage. To me, if you feel that she is committing adultery and it's wrong to leave, I really don't feel you're a true Christian. That's just how I and my Church feels. So you can tell us we're all wrong and you know the righteous path all you want, but we will be saying the same to you.

[Milovoriel 0]

Josh pal .... I'm getting the feeling that you quite enjoy stirring things up a bit and I respect that .... that said, I think you think way too much ....

 

for example .....

When sex involves 2 or more partners how can it be safe? I read about how the latex gloves that are basically the same material condoms are made of can't keep the STD germs or whatever from going through them. They can go right through gloves and the safest way is simply abstinence before marriage (and it needs 2 people to work).

 

Anyway, it seems like that's a common misconception that using a condom makes it safe.... Any thoughts?

lighten up will ya .... seriously .... if this is what abstinence does to you ....

 

oh, and if you think a woman should stay with a man who beats her 'cause your God only accepts fornication as a reason to divorce, then I despair of you .... I really do .... put your Bible down (preferably in the trash) and start thinking for yourself .... you know, rationally!

 

Cheerie .... ~M~

 

p.s Why have you shortened your user name?

[msdeeva 0]

Hi Josh,

I just wanted to expound on the Divorce issue. You stated:

If you hurt others then you are not fulfilling the Law (Romans 13:10) for love is the fulfilling of the Law because it doesn't harm others. Christ's great commandments were to love others.

Therefore, couldn't you say by the same token that if a man beats on his wife or threatens her life, he is not living accordance to God's law, and their marriage be null and void?

In addition, I have a question for you: When you see a news announcement that a man has killed his wife, do you think to yourself that she did the right thing by staying with him? Do you think "At least she lived in accordance to God's law" (as interpreted by you)?

[Joshua 0]

You know what, I figure since you don't want to expound on the "latex" issue, why should be continue to disagree about whether or not we are allowed to judge those outside of the Church even though it's stated in Corinthians I 5:12?On the topic of misinterpretation: I would like to know why you don't think Catholics didn't misinterpret the Bible during the Inquisition. I would also like to know, what makes you the end-all-to-be-all interpreter. How do you know that you haven't misinterpreted scriptures as well? After all, we are all only human, and the Bible states that although the main message will remain intact, the Book itself will be revised/changed/interpreted by man, and there will be error.You can think that Christ had olive skin all you want, if it helps you. I'm not going to argue on this. You can search the scriptures if you want, because I'm not wasting my time explaining how. Just as an FYI, though, the first Jews were Black. That should give you a start. Heck, the first people on earth were African. And if you argue this, I will point you toward a African history class taught by a white man at UCLA, and/or the Discovery channel to get you started on that.

I already responded to the "latex" issue a long time ago :

I never said anything about it being a rumor, I read a study about it in a magazine recently, I think it was USA Weekend if I recall correctly. I did a search and found condoms don't stop HPV, although that's not what I'm looking for:
http://forums.xisto.com/no_longer_exists/

If I find it again I'll show you, if I'd known I'd be quoting it I'd have kept the article at the time.

And you still haven't answered my question about what you think judging involves. I repeat, Christ said not to judge, He also said to judge not according to appearance but to judge righteous judgement, meaning you need to examine what the word "judge" involves in both cases then.

The Catholics didn't have much to do with a lot of the old NT fragments, those were from the early Church, which had very little in common with the current Roman Catholic Church. I'd like to see where in the Bible you read that "the Book itself will be revised/changed/interpreted by man, and there will be error."

Actually, the first people were believed to be from Mesopotamia, or the Middle Eastern region, which may have included parts of Africa, but was not solely African. *shrugs*

So are you saying that said Behemoths existed along side humans? Could it be possible that these behemoths are something different. In addition, where does the Bible talk about galaxies, planets, etc. Point me toward those scriptures. I suspect that they aren't there, but I could be wrong. If they aren't there, I am not suprised.
On the Catholic references: I'm not Catholic, so you don't have to convince me of anything. I was just simply pointing out the fact that they created the King James Bible and use it. So obviously they're seeing something you don't and vice versa. I don't get the praying to the saints thing myself. So you don't have to convince me.

When God talked to Job, Job didn't have to ask Him what the different animals were, they were familiar to him, so yes, I assume the Behemoths and what we call dinosaurs were definitely alive when humans were.

As far as what the Scriptures say about planets and galaxies:

Genesis 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: 15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.

Deuteronomy 4:19 And lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven, and when thou seest the sun, and the moon, and the stars, even all the host of heaven, shouldest be driven to worship them, and serve them, which the LORD thy God hath divided unto all nations under the whole heaven.

Psalms 74:16 The day is thine, the night also is thine: thou hast prepared the light and the sun.

Psalms 104:19 He appointed the moon for seasons: the sun knoweth his going down.

Psalms 136:7 To him that made great lights: for his mercy endureth for ever:
8 The sun to rule by day: for his mercy endureth for ever:
9 The moon and stars to rule by night: for his mercy endureth for ever.

Isaiah 40:22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

Jeremiah 10:12 He hath made the earth by his power, he hath established the world by his wisdom, and hath stretched out the heavens by his discretion.

As far as the divorce thing goes:
As I've said before, King James revised the Bible and pick and chose which scriptures were to be included. He was but a man, and could have just as easily interjected his own ideals into it.

I know in my heart that God would not allow a woman to stay in a violent marriage. To me, if you feel that she is committing adultery and it's wrong to leave, I really don't feel you're a true Christian.

That's just how I and my Church feels. So you can tell us we're all wrong and you know the righteous path all you want, but we will be saying the same to you.

And he could have made it to fit together so perfectly without flaw, could he? The Bible says not only that God gave the Bible but that He preserved it. There is more Bibliographical evidence, or manuscript authority, for the New Testament alone, then for any other great work of literature in antiquity. God has given more then enough to give us proof of the Bible's validity and authority.

The Bible is God's Word and it's following God's commandments that make you a Christian (and not by works but as it is written, faith in Christ alone) not by following what someone else feels in their heart.

lighten up will ya .... seriously .... if this is what abstinence does to you .... 
oh, and if you think a woman should stay with a man who beats her 'cause your God only accepts fornication as a reason to divorce, then I despair of you .... I really do .... put your Bible down (preferably in the trash) and start thinking for yourself .... you know, rationally!

Huh? I never said anything about staying with them, obviously the law should take its course in separating a man who is physically abusive, I just said there should be no divorce. And God has written His Word in my heart, and I know it to be the only truth I need to live my life by and will never give it up. The Bible is completely and utterly rational.

Also, the user name shortening was Johnny's suggestion, he noticed noone had picked Joshua as a username and offered to change mine, I accepted, and appreciate it.

Therefore, couldn't you say by the same token that if a man beats on his wife or threatens her life, he is not living accordance to God's law, and their marriage be null and void?
In addition, I have a question for you: When you see a news announcement that a man has killed his wife, do you think to yourself that she did the right thing by staying with him? Do you think "At least she lived in accordance to God's law" (as interpreted by you)?

The Bible says that what God therefore hath joined together, let not man put asunder. (Matthew 19:6) Christ gave the one thing that could nullify a marriage to be fornication, not violence. See my above post, I never said anything about her needing to stay with him, I spoke concerning divorce only.

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You know what, I figure since you don't want to expound on the "latex" issue, why should be continue to disagree about whether or not we are allowed to judge those outside of the Church even though it's stated in Corinthians I 5:12?On the topic of misinterpretation: I would like to know why you don't think Catholics didn't misinterpret the Bible during the Inquisition. I would also like to know, what makes you the end-all-to-be-all interpreter. How do you know that you haven't misinterpreted scriptures as well? After all, we are all only human, and the Bible states that although the main message will remain intact, the Book itself will be revised/changed/interpreted by man, and there will be error.You can think that Christ had olive skin all you want, if it helps you. I'm not going to argue on this. You can search the scriptures if you want, because I'm not wasting my time explaining how. Just as an FYI, though, the first Jews were Black. That should give you a start. Heck, the first people on earth were African. And if you argue this, I will point you toward a African history class taught by a white man at UCLA, and/or the Discovery channel to get you started on that.

I already responded to the "latex" issue a long time ago  :

And you still haven't answered my question about what you think judging involves.  I repeat, Christ said not to judge, He also said to judge not according to appearance but to judge righteous judgement, meaning you need to examine what the word "judge" involves in both cases then.

 

The Catholics didn't have much to do with a lot of the old NT fragments, those were from the early Church, which had very little in common with the current Roman Catholic Church.  I'd like to see where in the Bible you read that "the Book itself will be revised/changed/interpreted by man, and there will be error."

 

Actually, the first people were believed to be from Mesopotamia, or the Middle Eastern region, which may have included parts of Africa, but was not solely African.  *shrugs* 

When God talked to Job, Job didn't have to ask Him what the different animals were, they were familiar to him, so yes, I assume the Behemoths and what we call dinosaurs were definitely alive when humans were. 

 

As far as what the Scriptures say about planets and galaxies:

And he could have made it to fit together so perfectly without flaw, could he?  The Bible says not only that God gave the Bible but that He preserved it.  There is more Bibliographical evidence, or manuscript authority, for the New Testament alone, then for any other great work of literature in antiquity.  God has given more then enough to give us proof of the Bible's validity and authority. 

 

The Bible is God's Word and it's following God's commandments that make you a Christian (and not by works but as it is written, faith in Christ alone) not by following what someone else feels in their heart. 

Huh?  I never said anything about staying with them, obviously the law should take its course in separating a man who is physically abusive, I just said there should be no divorce.  And God has written His Word in my heart, and I know it to be the only truth I need to live my life by and will never give it up.  The Bible is completely and utterly rational. 

 

Also, the user name shortening was Johnny's suggestion, he noticed noone had picked Joshua as a username and offered to change mine, I accepted, and appreciate it. 

The Bible says that what God therefore hath joined together, let not man put asunder.  (Matthew 19:6)  Christ gave the one thing that could nullify a marriage to be fornication, not violence.  See my above post, I never said anything about her needing to stay with him, I spoke concerning divorce only.

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I'm pretty much done with you. You haven't addressed the latex issue at all. you haven't given any proof that shows that latex is permeable to STD microorganisms at all. You just made yourself look like an *bottom* when you tried to say that HPV was permeable. Hello? Anybody Home? HPV causes warts that are obviously contracted by SKIN-TO-SKIN CONTACT!!! Show me how HIV, Chlamidia, etc, can be contracted through INTACT latex. You still haven't!

 

You claim that the first people came from the middle east, yet you haven't even done any research. I've taken many classes from UCLA, from white professors that would beg to differ, yet here you are trying to argue with PhD's. The origin of the human race was in the heart of the Continent of Africa, spreading from West to East, then to Southern and Northern regions. I don't care if you don't want to look it up, because it just shows that you would prefer to remain ignorant. I mean, even the Discovery Channel had a program called "The Real Eve," explaining how the first woman (as described in the Bible), came from Africa. Yet here you come to spread your so-called knowledge. You know everything don't you? These people are all wrong, huh? Only you know the truth.

 

BTW You still haven't shown me any scriptures describing other planets and galaxies.

 

You continue to throw out scriptures, to supposedly "prove" your point, but in effect, you keep contradicting yourself. What about the whole divorce issue? You never answered my question: When you see on the news that a man killed his wife, what are you thinking? Are you thinking "At least she didn't leave and divorce him. She lived the righteous path of God"?

 

Give me a break.

 

I'm done with you.

 

As an endnote, I would like to leave you with something from the Bible. Maybe you can figure out what it meant:

 

Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air..."

Genesis 1:26.

 

So what does God mean when he says "us" and "our"? Don't tell me this is a typo, because as you basically stated that the Bible is perfect and hasn't been messed with.