God's Role In Natural Disasters Gods warning or Nature at work?

[Troubadour 0]

Well, getting back to the subject at hand... I personally don't think that God had anything to do with the tsunami in the way we would seem to think. Do I think that God is working through the tsunami disatster to further His kingdom? Absolutely.Here's my suggestion... just a suggestion mind you... Get a bible out, (preferably one you can understand... I like the NIV)... and read the book of Job. Job goes through huge trials and terrible disasters to his family and life as he knows it. God did not cause a single one of those things to happen to Job, he simply allowed them to happen because in the end it revealed God's true nature to Job and hopefully anyone who reads the text. It's one of my favorite books cuz the story is so crazy wierd.Oh yeah... Pete... Amen Brother.

[MajesticTreeFrog 0]

Here's my suggestion... just a suggestion mind you... Get a bible out, (preferably one you can understand... I like the NIV)... and read the book of Job.  Job goes through huge trials and terrible disasters to his family and life as he knows it.  God did not cause a single one of those things to happen to Job, he simply allowed them to happen because in the end it revealed God's true nature to Job and hopefully anyone who reads the text.  It's one of my favorite books cuz the story is so crazy wierd.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The problem here (as I see it) is that Christianity holds god as both Omniscient and Omnipotent. As such, things only occur, at all, because he allows them to. Being omniscient, he knows all that will happen, and always has known. Thus, at the time of creation, by choosing to create things as he did, he caused those events to happen to Job.

[Troubadour 0]

The problem here (as I see it) is that Christianity holds god as both Omniscient and Omnipotent.  As such, things only occur, at all, because he allows them to.  Being omniscient, he knows all that will happen, and always has known.  Thus, at the time of creation, by choosing to create things as he did, he caused those events to happen to Job.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ahh, the classic Predestination debate... I don't even want to get started on that! I'll fry my brain just thinking about it. It comes down to this... a paradox of sorts... Yes, God is omniscient, He knows what's going to happen before it happens. However, God created us with free will, meaning we have a choice, a decision in what we do. But if God already knows, then how do we have a choice at all? Is our existence just pointless, doomed to follow what God has already predestined for us? But we have free will, so God can't control what we do. We reason and choose on our own... Ow, my brain.

 

Again, this is futile for Humans to try to understand. We're trying to put into Human terms that which is not Human. It's impossible. I don't think anyone will ever understand this until they've passed on to the next life. Try as you may, you'll just end up with a very confused look on your face and migraine. I speak from experience.

[MajesticTreeFrog 0]

Ahh, the classic Predestination debate...  I don't even want to get started on that!  I'll fry my brain just thinking about it. It comes down to this... a paradox of sorts... Yes, God is omniscient, He knows what's going to happen before it happens.  However, God created us with free will, meaning we have a choice, a decision in what we do.  But if God already knows, then how do we have a choice at all?  Is our existence just pointless, doomed to follow what God has already predestined for us?  But we have free will, so God can't control what we do.  We reason and choose on our own...  Ow, my brain.

 

Again, this is futile for Humans to try to understand.  We're trying to put into Human terms that which is not Human.  It's impossible.  I don't think anyone will ever understand this until they've passed on to the next life.  Try as you may, you'll just end up with a very confused look on your face and migraine. I speak from experience.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually, there is an answer. For analogy, think of a movie, in film form with all the frame in front of you. That film represents our lives. Now, the being looking at that film is god. God is outside time. He can see all that will happen. The people in the film/life can make choices, and have free will. God is outside of time, and sees simply the choice that they make. Its a matter of perspective.

 

That still doesn't change that god can choose what will happen. However, it allows both an all powerfull god and free will.

[Troubadour 0]

Actually, there is an answer.  For analogy, think of a movie, in film form with all the frame in front of you.  That film represents our lives.  Now, the being looking at that film is god.  God is outside time.  He can see all that will happen.  The people in the film/life can make choices, and have free will.  God is outside of time, and sees simply the choice that they make.  Its a matter of perspective. 

 

That still doesn't change that god can choose what will happen.  However, it allows both an all powerfull god and free will.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey! That's a great analogy! I really like that one. Props to you MTF. You are absolutely right. Here we see a God that is al powerful, can choose what will happen should he wish to alter the course of the move/life, or simply allow it to take its course. I also think that God works through the things that happens for the better. God brings people closer to eachother and closer to Him. I think that God prepares us for the challenges we'll face further on in life by helping us through other challenges.

 

This begs the question... were the tsunami just a small taste of what we may face in the future? Now that a bunch of governments are working together to find a system to predict earthquakes and tsunami, perhaps it's possible.

[bboycraze 0]

i believe that God does exist... and i never thought of the tsunami happening in that way, but you have opened my eyes to that point of view... and that is that maybe God may have something to do with it, agree to disagree.. but that is my opinion

[rkage 0]

My input on the situation, as a firm christian, is that we have created the natural disasters ourselves. It's a fair point. Look at the amount of deaths caused by murder including war, i.e. deaths we have inflicted upon ourselves....and then look at deaths caused by natural disasters. There is a huge difference. Scale factor of ten thousand if i remember the statistics correctly.Blaming God is just the easy way out when something bad happens. God is an all loving god and if you ask him for help to cope with coming to grips with someone's death he will indeed help you. But when you ignore God for all of your life and then when something bad happens, blame him for it, then ask the question why doesn't God stop bad events...you can't expect an answer.The same topic arrived with September the 11th. Why didn't God stop the terrorist attack. Will if he did stop it do you want him to stop every murder? Yeh? Every abortion? Maybe? Every time you go to hit someone? Maybe Not? Everytime you get a paper cut?Where do you want him to draw the line, where can he draw the line? God give man freedom to chose to believe in him, he gave man the freedom to live. He has power's that will only confuse the smartest of mankind if they try to make sense of it so he could easily make us all follow him. But he gave mankind the choice... just some people will continue to throw it back in his face. I on the other hand, want to listen.

[darkfate 0]

Well if you think about what has happened in the world, it's not a very clear answer. Today we think everything has a scientific explaination. The fact of the matter is we don't. I don't believe that god created disaters. I am not a very relgious person myself, but there is that thing in you that says it might be from him. You will never know exactly.

[MajesticTreeFrog 0]

My input on the situation, as a firm christian, is that we have created the natural disasters ourselves.

....

The same topic arrived with September the 11th. Why didn't God stop the terrorist attack. Will if he did stop it do you want him to stop every murder? Yeh? Every abortion? Maybe? Every time you go to hit someone? Maybe Not? Everytime you get a paper cut?

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No one is talking about the terrorist attacks. They are talking about things like tidal waves. Did humans cause tidal waves?

(perhaps for environmental reasons they have a hand in it, but overall, no)

 

Unlike terrorism, which is a humans choice, no human is choosing a tsunami. The question is why(if there is a god), HE chooses to cause natural disasters.

 

Certainly humans cause even more damage, but that isn't the point. In fact, you could ask why God created us with the ability to feel greed and hate. Seems a design flaw to me.

[rkage 0]

No one is talking about the terrorist attacks. They are talking about things like tidal waves.  Did humans cause tidal waves?

(perhaps for environmental reasons they have a hand in it, but overall, no)

 

Unlike terrorism, which is a humans choice, no human is choosing a tsunami.  The question is why(if there is a god), HE chooses to cause natural disasters. 

 

Certainly humans cause even more damage, but that isn't the point.  In fact, you could ask why God created us with the ability to feel greed and hate.  Seems a design flaw to me.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You may call it a design flaw, I call it freedom. And if you read my post properly, you would see that I said that the same topic arised after 9/11, i'm not saying that the Tsunami was a terrorist attack and I thought that that was clear.

 

God is loving but he is also intolerant of the world of sinners and those who refuse to believe in him. The flaw comes with our way of believing. Man generally wants to be able to understand everything yet we just can't. Our brains just can't cope with the size of the Universe, we can't find the meaning of love or life, we can't believe in something we can't see. Maybe God created the Universe as a statement of his power?

 

When the Tsunami hit, assuming there was no god or afterlife, then why should we care about the deaths of those people? We should only care about our selves and the ones we love, so what if their little time on earth was cut short...as long as you get the most out of life, why should we worry about those that died, their soul ceases to exist so they won't mind.

 

Now saying there is a God, we can know that He has given them a simple choice to believe in him or not....so if they do then they'd go to heaven living a better life than on earth, if not they'd be down in hell suffering 24 hours a day without anything to look forward to ever. An eternity of pain that once again our brains will try to ignore and refuse to believe what an eternity of pain feels like. Yet the answers are in a book. It may be difficult to understand, but faith will do it for you. And I know that as a christian, that if a Tsunami did occur, or an earthquake or a terrorist attack, that I'd be in heaven for the eternity, safe and relaxed.

 

So you may still want to blame the natural disasters on God and in a way, He is responsible, but if you aren't prepared to try and understand why He would do it, then your post is just another post. I am not going to flame you or mock you because I am trying to see the angle you are coming from, and I agree with you that it is difficult to know why God would do it but sometimes other men can't give us the answer to everything, and even if they could, some of us wouldn't be prepared to listen.

[MajesticTreeFrog 0]

You may call it a design flaw, I call it freedom. And if you read my post properly, you would see that I said that the same topic arised after 9/11, i'm not saying that the Tsunami was a terrorist attack and I thought that that was clear.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No, you misunderstand what I said. I call it a design flaw that humans feel anger and hate. Because of these things, humans do terrible acts. They may choose to do them, but why give them the impetus? Without hate or anger or greed, people would still have choice. They COULD choose to do horrible things, but they would not(or at least wouldn't do such things for those reasons). God could even give humans the ability to have hate and anger and greed, but make them more easily consciously controlled. We could wake up, and choose not to be angry that day. Or set the conditions ourselves for our anger, or, or or. All of these are better ways of 'building' humans, given the list of things 'god does not want you to do'.

 

So you may still want to blame the natural disasters on God and in a way, He is responsible, but if you aren't prepared to try and understand why He would do it, then your post is just another post

I personally don't think god had anything to do with the natural disasters. I think they were the result of natural forces. But, that is because I do not believe in a god in the first place.

However, for those who DO believe, how do you reconcile your view as god as creator and shaper of the world who is all good, and the terrible things that occur that only he has control over?

[l337 Nurse Pedestrian 0]

God has nothing to do with it. He doesn't even exist. And if he doesn't exist to some people, how can he exist at all, also there are other gods, so it automatically cancels God out. So if it was God, it wouldn't be natural.Typhoons e.t.c.:It happens becuase clouds are forming, to cause a big rain storm, eventually causing a flood. Also the moon has an effect on the waves. As for tornados, that's just a bunch of wind. Lastly, the most notorious villain here, plate tectonics, which is responsible for water disasters, volcanos and tremors.

[Vagodeoz 0]

I'll quote a part of one movie (even though the point was other):It was something like "God makes everything, he created the world and all the beautifull things on it, but when he makes a mistake, it's not his fault, it's mother nature."

[mitchellmckain 0]

The bible actually has something very interesting to say on this topic. In Genesis, after the flood God was apparently sorrowful over the destruction of the earth and said "never again will I destroy the earth for the sake of man." This seems to imply an attitude or methodology change on the part of God. It suggests that once God may have been willing to try solving the problem of human misbehavior by using natural disasters but having seen the result, has decided that it is not worth it. This suggests that God has left nature to take its natural course and does not interfere. I find the hands off policy quite understandable. It reminds me of Star Trek's prime directive. Ok, so it seems likely that God does cause natural disasters to punish people, but why doesn't he stop them from hurting people or at least warn us to prepare. Well it is clear to me that the greatest danger to the well being of humans is humans. We solve one source of conflict only to find something else to fight about. So why should God stop nature from distracting us from our efforts to destroy ourselves. Why should God eliminate the threat of nature as a "common enemy" or at least a common cause, so we can put more of our energy into inventing enemies among ourselves. Why should God prevent one misery so that create a much worse misery ourselves. Putting myself in his place, I think I would be tired of my every effort to reduce suffering only leading to greater suffering because of the perversity of man. No, the prime directive makes a lot of sense.

[rachelwase 0]

I think it's arrogant to assume that God would send down judgment upon Thailand of all places. Here in The U.S. there aremore similarities to sodum & gamora than any where else. Americans are the most self centered people on the planet. If God was going to rain down judgment I think it would have been here in the states. Speaking of which. Has it occured to anyone else that we've been having an awful lot of earth quakes lately?