musicianly

It's much more difficult to describe the matter with my father than you think. This has been an ongoing process for the last 4 years and to keep myself healthy, I need to remove myself from this environment. Because of the amount of time I have to make this decision, moving out will be absolutely necessary. Working things out with my father is a completely different situation in itself. I know for a fact that my presence here is one of the major causes of stress between them. When they fight, they do so because they disagree on topics involving me. My father bases his values on a merit system. Due to my difficulty in school, he has said, word for word, "you don't deserve to do things your way; you've failed and now I have to do it for you." Please believe that I might understand my situation/relationship with my father a little more intimately than most other people might. Even counselors, psychiatrists, pastors and priests have told our family that he is resolute in his ways. I brought up the caravan idea to him and he shook his head, more insulted that I would want the luxury of independence without the responsibility than he was concerned with solving the dilemma that I face. This is an example of why I am moving out, to learn to be self sufficient and further develop my own integrity. I'm sorry if all of this comes across as me being upset, I'm not (don't worry). My father really won't work with me at all, he isn't going to do anything to support me in the ways I could support myself while I'm getting through school. The obvious first choices in the situation would be to try and work things out with my father, because going to school at home is more ideal than going to school while living on one's own. The problem lies within my father, it's part of his personality/character. It's nothing I can chance and no attitude or will that I can convince otherwise. While things may be unhealthy for my mother, I can't stay home until she passes, I have my own life to live and need to get my life started. Please don't get me wrong though, I love her deeply and would do anything to help her that's within my ability. But it's not within my ability to convince her she's in an unhealthy environment. I've brought it up to her multiple times and she's a very loyal and committed wife to my father. Not to mention she's already chronically depressed and because of that, she is considered handicapped (thus she can't work). I digress, the goal in my mind is to prepare to move out. I have no other options if I want to be successful in my own life. This is why I'm so diligent in working to make my goal a reality and move out as soon as I can. While doing so relieves my father of his responsibility over me, it will benefit me far greater and teach me to truly take care of myself in times of need. So anything (suggestions, personal experiences, etc.) that might help me be better prepared to move out would be more than appreciated. I've already started including the things I didn't previously know into my plan (my budget, my knowledge of utility costs, etc.) and they've really helped me. Perhaps there's anything else I might not know or understand? How about things like health care and life insurance, etc.? I'm still under my father's military health care and know nothing about how it works (if it works any differently) in the civilian lifestyle. How much it might cost, or where I can find that cost, what types companies offer, and so on. Thank you again for trying to help me so much, everything here is giving me more to work with and better preparing me for what's to come. Additionally, this is a lot of effort for you two to put into a discussion forum, much less a thread by me, and I'd like you to know I really appreciate it!

Hmmm, I hadn't previously considered something like that. Unfortunately because of my father's demeanor, it has to be a "black or white" scenario. Either I stay home and abide by his rules (which I respect) and agree to his terms (which, at times, I question) or I move out. I can't be coming back home for anything, much less living in the back yard. The ideas about going to the store with my mom and taking part in the bills with my dad are really good ideas though, I'll definitely get started on those so I can learn more about that. Considering my recent personal decision, I really like the prospect of moving out simply because I experience very limited interaction with my parents even though they're always around the house. It's only if dad's around, though. My mother talks and interacts with me, she's very giving and enjoys relationships, but my father favors the "bold idle male" figure...He only talks to me when I've done something he can "fix" or shown a character trait that he wants to "better." Otherwise, he and I don't speak. In moving out, I can focus, both practically and therapeutically, on becoming who I want to be. I can avert my attention to things that matter and learn to be even more productive with my time, especially during times like this.Oh how I wish the caravan idea would work, though, I do find it financially beneficial and a good safety mechanism for unexpected future happenstances. All I can reasonably focus on at the moment is a way to move on and forward, especially since there's no way around the things that are going on. Educationally, I do need to take small steps, so part time is absolutely perfect for me. The fewer classes I have, the more effort I can put into each class. I can see myself getting straight A grades throughout general education and with the time it will take me to do that I'll be able to wipe these no-good F grades clean off of my transcript (there's an option to remove up to 4 grades/classes off of your transcript at once after so many semesters since you started attending the college).I really am happy there are people out there that care, thank you! I'm definitely getting a more well rounded idea of the magnitude of moving out, but even in the face of such a big even, I hold no fear and worry not. Where I fail, I will learn, and where I succeed, I will grow. That being said, I certainly know the consequences of failing after moving out are much harsher than if I were at home, but that's a responsibility I'm willing to take.Any other things I can keep in mind as I prepare to move out? Perhaps there are things I could watch out for, simple mistakes someone like myself might make during the process?

I've been thinking about the exact same thing for a while now. It's been a goal of mine to find a way to connect with my dad and overcome our differences so we can establish a positive, supportive relationship with one another, yet sometimes that goal strays and the dynamics tend to justify the result: see, my dad who, at times, is very strict and regulated, has a history of minor violent behavior. He's still struggling with himself to overcome a tendency towards anger and aggression that arises each time he feels threatened. On occasions where I've respectfully brought up the idea of him backing off, he's become defensive, contemptuous, and controlling, since he truly feels he knows what's best. He already has "control" of the household since my mother follows in his wake in many regards. They, together, tend to be very conservative and stoutly religious. Insomuch, there have been times during which mom has tried to vouch for me and his response is this: "The Bible teaches that a father is the head of the household...if you don't support me right now, you're taking away my right to lead this family." Avoiding whether or not this holds any validity, I feel it's a little bit controlling, and my mother (who is a natural caregiver) consistently responds to these things in a way that he expects her to.Before you ask, yes I've been through the phase in his life where he could not control his anger and, in effect, acted abusively towards my mother and I. It's already been dealt with, so her and I won't have to worry about things ever getting that bad again, (we've had family counseling/therapy for most of my recollected life) but he's still very difficult to talk to at times.I graduated from high school early, and I started college right after, but following the first two semesters I took a year off to work and learn how to incorporate that mentality into my life. This last semester has been my third, but again, they've all been separated so despite the time in school, I've been able to observe my father's tendencies outside of school and determine well enough that I truly to have to (as I think I've mentioned) do as he says and "move out of the house if I want to do what I desire in college." That's why I'm working so much and that's the appeal of having two jobs (a full and part time). The average cost of a studio apartment here is about $900, not including utilities, water, et cetera. If I dropped the part time job, my monthly pay would fall from 2500 (prior to taxes) to about $1900 (prior to taxes). With everything I will be needing to make use of for school and pay for simply to stay alive and attend my engagements, my estimated cost of living is about $2000, so I'm already walking a thin, thin line. Because of where I live in the city, it wouldn't be ideal to move to the locations where the apartments are actually $900; I would be spending more gas to go where I need to. Thus, my compromise is a $1000 apartment and that's the cheapest I've found so far. If you are familiar with the cost of gas here, it's leveling out at around $4.00 per gallon so I spend about $200 a month on gas alone (with everywhere I am required to be, not including leisurely travelling). Regarding school, my father has been paying for my attendance, but if I move out I will, of course, be paying for it myself (with student loans, or after a year of being legally independent, grants and financial aid). Now comes the strike out: My gpa isn't high enough for me to qualify for financial aid to begin with; with how much my father makes at his job, I've never qualified for it at home; this leaves me with student loans. I believe the trouble is, I have to pay them off after having been out of "full time" schooling for 6 months. My short term goal then, must be to organize a schedule that will allow me to attend a 9 month trade school, after which I will have access (risky, I know) to opening positions in whatever field I choose. After I can begin that job, I'm positive I can find a steady schedule, and with increased pay from having a license and a job that matches it, I'll soon be able to find a way to integrate that into my new schedule, working that and perhaps whichever other job can allow for the flexibility I need to begin going to college again.Of course, this is all a lot of work, and I'm willing to do it. Although I've not given up on my relationship with my parents, individually and together, I understand that sometimes parents relate with their children (and respect their decisions) more when they see them succeeding without any guidance. That being said, I can have a much kinder relationship with him after I move out, rest assured. When it comes to living conditions, I've already been perusing Craigslist to find maybe just a room I could rent in someone else's house, but to no avail. There are also postings at my school site and none have been very ideal for me either. The best option for me (after much assessment) is to go ahead with the apartment plan.Here's another reason why it works so well: I was able to get my own credit card before the law was passed that disallowed anyone under 18 to have one. I've been using it each month, making the payments, and in addition to this I've taken out a loan or two at the bank (fully paid off now) and have fully paid off a financed laptop for school. With my knowledge of credit, I'm not sure of whether or not paying my cell phone bill counts as well, but that's another thing I have to maintain with regard to financial integrity. My credit is actually pretty decent now (they say no credit is worse than bad credit), and I could rent just about any apartment I want, provided I have the money to do so.This is another way in which the breakup was so difficult, since her and I were planning on splitting the cost of the apartment (that would have helped a LOT), but I'm fine doing things by myself too, I just have to work with what I have. Now my degree choice! Being a music major would allow me to do what I love, and do it with even more passion than I've been allowed to at home. I'm confident that once I fix the grades at my college, I could generate enough attention that I'd eventually be able to attend Juilliard. With or without Juilliard, I would have the option of becoming a composer for the recording industry (TV, movies, etc) as I would also have been able to take the classes that teach me audio engineering skills. Conversely, if I go the psychology route, I can look forward to much more job security (in more than one aspect). There is a demand for therapists in a lot of places I'd be looking to go, and even therapist assistants (while starting out). I would be able to monopolize upon my degree in psychology and, in the future, go back to school for some music to learn to incorporate music therapy into my practice. I may even, by that time, have the knowledge and skills to crossover job areas and become a communications scientist. Overall, the psychology degree will be more reliable, I'll still be doing something I'm very, very interested in (and passionate about), and I'll have even more opportunity to safely add to that degree later. Not to mention, I want a family, and I want to give them security and peace of mind.And about sharing a place with a stranger, I would be alright doing so, but at the cost of privacy and some security/comfort. Not to mention my father has greatly opposed this idea...he's had more than a little to say about it.In the midst of all of this, my primary objective for this very moment is to learn financial responsibility. I want to be able to make a living, properly follow a budget, and live comfortably (not paycheck to paycheck). Once I have that down, I'll be able to successfully move out (especially given by then my knowledge of what it takes to make a living will allow me to modify my job condition to meet whatever standards I have). I'm confident in my abilities, simply unsure of the means meeting their desired ends at the moment.

It seems to me that in taking a step back and looking at what many people are trying to do, including those that have posted on this thread, the answer to this might be simpler than one might think.Many many people are born every day, and this isn't debatable. Many people do, in fact, make decisions that poorly contribute to the overall well-being of humankind and the planet, this too, isn't debatable. There are also many people who do, in fact, strive to make the world a better place, and strengthen the many facets of humankind's ability to contribute, many that we don't know about, this also isn't debatable. What I'm leading up to is this: Many people inhabit the earth. It seems the larger goal in human nature is to make sense of things, and everyone has different methods of doing so pertaining to the magnitude of each person's life. While it would be unfair to say, promote genocide, I understand that many well-to-to people conversely believe it is unfair for another person to, for example, live in such a way that doesn't contribute to the overall meaning of humanity.With each person born on earth, there is an added perspective. Life means different things to different people. Without the intent of being petty, Hitler found meaning in his life through creating a movement that killed many, many people. Gandhi found meaning in his life through offering ideas with which others might add to the meaning in their lives. In the same way, with whatever intent you might have, you must find a way to produce meaning in your life. We're not given as much as we might like to be able to do so, but with what we have, we move forward. Live a life to think about later, or think about a life to live and don't live it at all.Best regards,Musicianly

Oh wow, I can't believe I had left out such small things! Plus, I use them every day, I guess I really do take some things for granted living at home...Thanks for the car advice, do you think once it goes I'll still be able to find someone to sell it to for parts? It would be nice to get as much out of it as I can, given I don't have a huge amount of money to work with. The biggest thing I have to deal with right now is where I live, as it is both a challenge to live here, but also quite filled with job opportunities. Southern California, from my observations, is a pretty high cost area in some parts and I certainly live in one of those parts. The average rent in my area is about $2000 so I'm lucky I found someplace as cheap as I did (about $1000 a month plus utilities).I definitely feel it's good for me to have decided to move out prior to actually doing so, at least because I'll be able to more adequately prepare rather than get to the point where I have enough money saved up and spontaneously decide I need to. As for a pet, I definitely couldn't take responsibility for a dog or cat, perhaps an animal that would take less attention, especially since I'm gone for most of the day. It would be wonderful to have a small dog, though. My parents have one, and he's such a wonderful boy.I still need to speak with the service providers in the area to see what their policies are. Their websites advertise the purchase of one service without another, so once I speak to them I'll be able to find out what I have to get...albeit a home phone is much cheaper than what my cell phone costs per month. For basic internet, I'm looking at about about $50 per month. I definitely need to see if I can lower my $80 cell phone bill. I've got the cheapest plan that has unlimited texting at least, but I'm not sure if I can pick out what parts of the plan I use most and make some cuts.On needing people: I don't really have anyone around to begin with. My father and mother are the only two people that I have much interaction with and I have no idea how to engage people at work simply because they can be hit-and-miss. I'll ask some of them if they want to hang out or do something throughout the week and even the ones that get back to me (that say yes) end up blowing me off. With the breakup I just went through, the people I thought were closest to me actually stopped talking to me, leaving me so they might be able to support her a little more. I've got a best friend but he's in the army so I rarely see him, and don't get to talk to him much. Back to my father and mother, I have an inhibited relationship with each because of a number of things. When it comes to my father, I'm quite opposite to him in terms of personality. He's been in the military for close to 30 years now, so he can be strict sometimes and tends to focus more on being 100% capable of whatever one needs to be 100% of the time. I'm a musician, and am quite free spirited and creative at heart, although that's not my major (I tried to establish that as my first major but he told me I couldn't live at home if that's what I wanted to do). My mother is the one I relate to the most, yet my father demands so much attention from her I don't have a reasonable place in either of their lives at the moment. Take, for example, mother's day. I wasn't even able to take her out to have lunch because he was angry at her for not waking up early enough to go to church, therefore she told me she felt obligated to stay home and make it up to him (not sexually, of course). Overall, my life has placed me in conditions which some people might find to be bleak (relationship-wise) but I find my strength in the connections I'm able to make (whenever I can make them) and keep (my friend in the army). I also take refuge in my hobbies, which are quite active and, in a sense, social. I enjoy getting out of the house and being out in society.Regarding my major, I'm actually still in General Education and I'm majoring in Psychology. My goal is to become a relationship therapist and help people to better establish and maintain relationships, and during the process, learn how to better do so for myself. I have been trying as hard as I can to work diligently in school while I'm at home, but some dynamics in my relationships with each parent make it difficult for me to fully apply myself. I ended up failing one class my first semester and dropping out of the rest (withdrawing). The next semester, I received a C in one class and, again, withdrew from the rest. This semester, I have attended the classes, for the most part, and ended up failing almost all of them. I know this isn't who I am, my history in high school says otherwise (I was a straight A and B student with one or two C grades). Now, during each semester, there comes a time when my father feels the need to micro-manage my schoolwork, so he begins demanding that he be allowed to check it, check my grades, and keep track of things like attendance and application-degree (how I put effort into learning and how much I actually learn). Every single time he begins doing this, I lose my own motivation and find school to be more than unpleasant. I'm unable to focus because I don't know if I'm focusing as well as HE'D like me to. In effect, he's very good at getting into my head and convincing me I'm not as good of a person as I can be, and I value his opinions and advice, so I take it into consideration...and I'm able to see many different ways of reaching the same goal, so I can never find a problem with what he says, the thing is, he frequently tells me there's a "HIS house,HIS rules" policy so I find if I try to do things my own way, he finds fault in those methods and tries to "fix" them with his own.I'm simply not able to be my own person at home, and that's my goal for moving out and going to school while I'm alone. I don't have friends to split a room with (or a girlfriend to do so with anymore) so it has to be me, by myself.Those are my main reasons for moving out, in addition to building a foundation upon which I can establish my independence. I know, it might seem as though my motivations are rash and emotional, but please believe me when I say I've been attempting schooling at home for a year and a half, and while I've failed thus far, I believe that once I'm accountable to myself and only myself, I can rise above my previous challenges and become what I'm truly meant to become.

Alright everyone, whoever might read this, I'm just past the age where I can move out and am doing so, and I'd be very grateful for some pointers regarding how to do so without having to worry too much about things I might not know I'll have to deal with. Starting out, I'm working two jobs and going to college part time. I've got full time and a part time job. I make roughly 2200 a month, and I'm ready to do one of a couple of things with this income. My ideas are as follows (this will be step 1 for me):A. Save up to buy a new car that will last me a while. *I have a car already, but it's a '96 with 170k miles. While the miles go up, I've noticed I've had to put more work into it, so with that in mind should I buy a new car or rough it for as long as I can?B. Save up so I can afford a security deposit for an apartment and begin living on my own. *I live at home still, and I've been here for longer than I'd like. I'm getting kind of antsy and feel I need a new environment in which I could focus on school more effectively. I've been failing classes like crazy but I do just fine when I'm not living at home. (I've tried it before)I guess I'll start with that. With regard to moving out, I've taken into consideration a number of things:1. Rent2. Cell phone bill3. Car insurance/registration, etc.4. Monthly cost of food (as projected by by USDA website)5. Internet (I won't be needing cable tv or a landline since I have a cell)6. Utilities and water7. Average monthly gas usage8. Luxury expenses (I've kept this to a minimum so that I have enough for everything else)Is there anything I might be missing? Again, please don't think I'm stupid, I'm just starting off and haven't ever been on my own before, so any advice would help. Staying at my parents much longer isn't going to be an option...Thanks all!!Musicianly

Wow, you two are great, thank you so much for all the help and advice. You're both right, you can't change how a person chooses to feel about another, just yourself. My mom raised me with that saying: "The only thing you can control in any given situation is yourself." While things might seem pretty dim right now, I know they'll pick up, and like you said, maybe one day if everything permits we'll run into each other again and be different people who are finally good for each other. I know people change all of the time, and that it's just part of life, especially at this age, to have frequent fluctuations of beliefs and values. I'm starting to truly believe that I can move on now and really push my life in the direction I want it to go, without someone there whom I'm always factoring into the bigger picture. I believe she was right in a funny way when she said, "I need to learn to rely on myself first," because I'm going through just as much inner turmoil and confusion given my place in life. It's hard enough to get through college, but I'm working a part time job and a full time job while doing so, I guess I have enough on my plate.I did write her a letter, just to help myself move through this and also to give her the emotional freedom to go do whatever she feels she needs to so she can succeed in life. In summary, I explained to her that I'm ok with her decision and that although I've been really confused and thrown off by everything that's happened, it's because I understand that it's over between us. Even though I made the irrational mistake of panicking while things were working themselves out (and they still are, but I'm no longer this emotionally distorted) I feel the letter really helped. I told her I hope that maybe one day when we have different lives and maybe even lovers, we'll be able to run into each other and, out of respect and love for what we had, be able to be friendly and kind with one another.There's no way around the importance she's had in my life for the last 2 years, simply the joy of having been lucky enough to be with her. And I feel like if there's one thing I'll take away from all of this, it's just that. I've been absolutely devastated by all of this, and I've never in my life experienced such a loss, such a hole, such a void. But backing away from the pain of the moment, I see something much larger at play. I experienced something my heart defined as true love, and simply because of that, I have even more to give to another person or (again, if we ever have a chance to rekindle our romance in the future)even her, provided things are right between us. After a couple of days thinking over things, I'm becoming myself again, but slowly. It's a process, as are many other things, but necessary at that. Life does things like this to people, it bring joy, pain, anger, everything imaginable. I don't think if somewhere in the story of my life I wasn't meant for something more, I'd have to go through this. That by learning from this, and remembering in my heart the things that mean the most to me, I'll have succeeded where some struggle. Maybe I can even help someone else in the same position one day, be it a friend, someone I don't even know (on this forum or even out in the world), or when I'm blessed enough, my children.On a side note, I have some questions about life, and I really enjoy both of your opinions, so if you happen to be browsing and come across one of them, I'd be more than happy to hear your takes on the topics!Dearest regards, Musicianly

Thanks Jase, One thing that's hard for me to understand is what she meant by "unhealthy." When I asked her, she said it was unhealthy because we fought. We don't fight that often or about that many things, recently I've had a hard time conveying something to her that I have been worried about and she's either ignored my speaking about it and become defensive, or told me it's something I have to change in myself. I've been trying to work on reciprocation with her, because she doesn't expect to have to even say hello to me when I go to her house. I think if nothing else if the basic interactions between two partners are hurting for more effort, then the two should talk about what they can do to help each other. The hardest thing to do has been to find a (very specific) way of bringing it up to her without her drawing the conclusion that I'm not happy with her. Although everything is over and done now, I'm just trying to make sense of it all. I love her very much, and whatever it is we're going through right now is really influencing my day to day schedule. (I'm pretty depressed. Staying busy, but I just can't stop thinking about the things we've gone through and how far we've come only to surrender our relationship to something that could have been fixed.) I wake up with a racing heart, racing thoughts, and my heart physically hurts. In just two days I've lost about 4 lbs and have only slept for 4 hours. It's really at the front of my mind. I'm giving her time, and it's only been a day since we've spoken at all, so I'm not sure how long to give her. Sometimes I feel the want to talk to her, but I fight the feeling and it just hurts more.

I'm not much older than 20 and I just went through a breakup with the first love of my life. We were together for a total of 3 years, but had to take a two year break between the first and second year. This last try lasted two years and I wish with all my heart that it could have lasted longer, but seeing as it ended (and how it ended)I'm confused about a lot of things right now.Her and I have a lot in common, similar interests, similar dreams, and personalities that complement each other completely. Our differences aren't awful either. Things such as methods for achievement and emotional interpretation are examples of our differences. I simply don't understand why things ended the way they did, or where they might go from here. I'm very grounded in compassion and empathy. I will do my very best to try to understand what a person means by what they're saying, how they feel while they say it, how things going on in his/her life could influence the way they feel about the topic, and even how they physically feel in the moment. So here's the story from my side.Over the last six months, I've been trying to talk to her about doing things that might build our connection in the relationship. After a while, it felt like she just gave up. I wanted that connection back and I have been willing and wanting so badly to work with her to find it again. With all good hopes, there are things standing in the way, I guess. I noticed her saying things like, "I shouldn't have to do anything to make you happy with me," and, "It's the man's role in a relationship to take care of the woman, she shouldn't be obligated to do anything." It seemed I just couldn't communicate my hopes for our relationship in a way that she'd understand or take to heart.She's the same age as me and she's very guarded when it comes to men. We were all of each other's firsts, and while I know that does, in many ways, play a huge role in how likely people are to stay together solely on those grounds, but during our two year break, I was with someone else, so I can see past those things and focus on simply being happy with her. Our losses? Well, in addition to the usual things lost from a breakup (time spent with each other, moments you'll never get back, money put into all of it, etc.) we had already decided to get married. On the more sentimental side, we even named our first kids. (If that tells you how serious we were about getting married)Since this is long already, I'll try to shorten the rest. We were happy together, but as our connection (as I saw it) was fading, our fighting increased and, likewise, our inability to work with one another. After the last fight, she decided our relationship as a whole was unhealthy for us, and while I disagreed saying we could work things out if we try to set our differences aside, she just didn't want to try. She didn't tell me if we were breaking up because she thought it was unhealthy, or if it was another reason, but her last words to me were, "I want to be able to rely on myself first." My question is: What could this mean? Does she want me to wait for her, should I? Why did the person I knew so well seemingly turn off her feelings like they were controlled by a light switch? Finally, why didn't she want to try to work things out? Because I know in my heart, with my integrity, that we could have if we'd only come together...

Hi Alex, It sounds like your relationship is really hurting from the inside out. By that, I mean it sounds as though you may be experiencing a loss of connection with your wife. I've never been in a hugely long-term relationship, the most I've been with someone is 3 years, but in those 3 years I picked up a lot of neat things to work with. It really can be tough sometimes maintaining a relationship in the midst of life's obstacles (work, maybe kids, perhaps you have pets) and it's helpful for me to remember that while they do very much represent obstacles, they are responsibilities at the same time. In every relationship, people run into times where they doubt, they stray, maybe even split up for some time while they get their mental facets in line so they can come back to it rejuvenated and willing to really work to find a more natural chemistry with the person.Please don't take that to mean time apart will help you, I'm just trying to exemplify how many different things relationships have to go through sometimes. Because it seems as though it's the connection between you two that is hurting for more attention, I would recommend taking a look at some of the relationship studies done by doctors John and Julie Gottman. They have some wonderful insights into this confusing road block a lot of relationships tend to hit at some point.What it comes down to is really working with your partner. To be able to open up those lines of trust and honesty, I think you two will find common ground on which you can begin finding your love again. Again, don't worry, sometimes people get discouraged and scared, but it's amazingly wonderful to be able to recognize that there is a problem because in just seeing it, one can find the means to solve it.-Derek