London Bombings Aftermath ...two people murdered...

[brainless 0]

As many news corporations reported, the british police shot a person suspected to be linked to the "failed" London bombings earlier this month because he refused to stop when a police officer in civilian clothing asked him to do so but ran into a subway station, where an police officer killed him with five shots into the head after he tripped and fell.

Eye witnesses described the killing as if it was rather a cold-blooded murder than as an act of maintaining public security:

[...] One of them was carrying a black handgun - it looked like an automatic - they pushed him to the floor, bundled on top of him and unloaded five shots into him. [...]

-> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4706787.stm
The official story is that the man shot refused to obey police instructions. What most news sites do not mention while they write about the police instructions is that they came from cops in civilian clothing. In my opinion the "suspect" was absolutely right to make a run for it because about two weeks ago, a muslim has been beaten to death due to his religion:

[...] According to several sources, the man had gone to a shop around 4.30pm on Sunday to buy cigarettes, and the youths had asked him to hand them over.When he refused they shouted that he was Taliban, a reference to the hardline Muslim government that ran Afghanistan and harboured al-Qaida terrorists.
The man was punched and fell to the ground and later died in hospital. Police have yet to officially announce the results of a postmortem examination. [...]

-> http://forums.xisto.com/no_longer_exists/

And as if this wasn't enough - I just read [unfortunately on a german-only news site] that Scotland Yard announced that the man shot was an innocent person, a spokesperson said:

(translated by me) [This is] A tragedy which the London police regrets.

-> http://forums.xisto.com/no_longer_exists/
oh, and by the way, he's been suspected to be involved in the "failed" bombings for leaving a house which was observed by the police. That's all. Leave the wrong house, run when people on the street ask you to stop - and be killed...

To say it with the words of a favorite band of mine:

We've got no rights when cops can kill,It's not right, we live in fear

Fear of what you're gonna do, when a cop's talking *BLEEP* to you
Fear of what you're gonna say, when the cops come gunning your way
Fear of what you shouldn't do, when the cops try to provoke you
Fear that on any given day, the cops could take your life away...

[ashiezai 0]

The great britain pound has dropped quite significantly and the stock market too ... hope that the terrorist will stop all this kinda stupid act ..

[adriantc 0]

By beeing afraid and over protective we give those terrorists satisfaction. Once we are afraid their mission is compleate. Because we have to realise that their ultimate objective is not to kill as much people as they can, but to inspire as much fear as they can. If people start to panic and not do their daily routines it means that the terrorists have won. The aftermath of london bombings just gives them satisfaction because the guverment is afraid and the police is shooting everybody up.A few days ago I noticed on Yahoo News that the Patriotic Act has been made active for an unlimited period of time. That means taping (dont know if this is the spelling) the phones, reading the medical hestory, even you library history (?!?). As more and more freedoms are destroyed the terrorist came closer to their final goal.

[brainless 0]

*update* Here's the police story on BBC (for those who'd like to have an english source and not a german one): http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4712061.stm

 

And, according to BBC News,

[sir Ian] acknowledged "somebody else could be shot" as the hunt continued, but added "everything is done to make it right".

well, might be somebody just as innocent.

Just another note towards police incompetence: A friend of mine whom I trust about finding valuable informations has read somewhere that the person shot left a house with a couple appartements to rent. So the reason why he was suspected to be linked to a terrorist group is that he lived in the same block of flats.

Maybe the London police should execute all of London citizens, just to make sure that no person who could be linked to a terrorist group in any way remains in the city?

 

well, I don't want to stray off-topic here by suggesting who profits the most from the "terrorist threat", cheers to the world's leaders...

[Saint_Michael 3]

well its just simple stupidity on both parts if the guy just stopped and talk to them none of it would have happen, but the bobbies went over board though, all they had to do was immobilize him killing his was not the way to go.

[boyCradle 0]

The london police is getting paranoid about the bombings. They shoot an innocent man thought to be a participant in the attempted bombing. it is not an standard operating procedure to fire at the suspect, he is after all just a suspect.

[emperor 0]

I'm not a fan of police, but I must admit that these things can happen after the attack to London. Ok that a terrorists can attack a city, but if they make it twice in two weeks it isn't normal. Policemen seem fool man if they have allowed terrorist to make a second attack. So if they say a man running away in a undeground with a bag, they have shot. London's police is too tight to think well. Probably, if I were that policemen, I will have made the same thing.Anyway is a very dangerous things and the government should make something.But the problem is always the same, Al Qaeda and Co. can hit every nations every time they want.

[brainless 0]

He didn't carry a bag and some eye-witness gave false reports (in early BBC stories there where witness quoted who said that some wires sticked out of his coat).A co-worker of mine and I just figured out that we shouldn't appear in public anymore since we're way more dangerous than someone who simply lived in the same block of flats as a terrorist -- we're working at a swimming pool and have access to three brand-new bottles of chlorine, about 500 liters (about 120 gallons if I'm not mistaken) each. Guess what one single person could do with those - and we could order another set of those without anyone becoming suspicious. ok, the next subway station is a few cities away but the next large train station is just a few kilometres from the pool......so why don't people get the idea of executing us? we actually figured out how to kill and severely injure hundreds of people and probably won't encounter any problems while doing this...

[Milovoriel 0]

God, Brainless you really have got it in for the British police .... they made a huge mistake shooting that poor Brazilian guy and I can only offer my sympathies to his family and friends .... yeah, even if they had thought he was a terrorist, why pump 5 bullets into the guy, why not just immobilise him?

 

I've no answer for this .... but I've no doubt someone will have to be held accountable .... and quite right too, it's inexcusable ....

 

London is reeling from the last two weeks .... first the bombings which killed over 50 people and injured 300 more and then, a week later 4 other bombs went off .... again targetting the tube and bus services .... this time, fortunately the bombs apparently failed to detonate properly so no injuries ....

 

We're living in uncertain times and need some form of stability .... the police are part of our infrastructure .... we need them .... there far from perfect, but when I look at the security services in other countries around the world, I think we here in Britain are quite fortunate.

 

You don't even live in this country Brainless .... so could you keep your anti-British police rhetoric to yourself .... we really could do without it just now, thank you very much!

[brainless 0]

Yes, I've got it in for the British police - and for the german and for the US american and for the french and for the russian and for any other armed forces. It's just that the UK's in the press right now, at any given day I could fetch you reports about human rights violations by any given nation's security forces (be it police, be it military, be it paramilitary, be it secret service -- about some there are more reports, less about others).

As you have realized, an innocent person has been killed. Now you offer your sympathies, just as your government, the police and many other people do. But what good do these sympathies do Jean Charles de Menezes (aka victim of a racist system)? Can you undo the terrible mistake like you could release him from jail when he turns out to be innocent?

Yes, someone will be held accountable - but this person will not receive the death penalty, this person will not even be imprisoned as long as the court will sentence him to (it has happened before, it will happen again) and walk out of prison as a free man.
Did you keep in mind tha Sir Ian predicted that "someone else will be shot" in London's 'war on terrorism'? Who can promise that the next person shot by police officers will not be innocent, again? Can you? You shouldn't, because when the next innocent dies you won't remember this promise...

Yeah, London's citizens might be a bit upset after some people carried the war they keep up back to them. In some places in the "Middle East", innocent people are killed by security forces (namely police, military and foreign military) every day, and no one who is being listened to complains about this. Why do british leaders apologize to Mr. Menezes' friends and family but not to the Iraqi people? Is it ok to kill hundreds of thousands innocent people abroad while it's not ok to kill one innocent person "at home"?

Yes, we live in uncertain times and yes, we need some form of stability - but if it's instability or racism (after all, the "good guys" are from the USA, Canada, EU-Europe, Japan, Australia, New Zealand and sometimes South Africa while the "bad guys" are from "Eastern Europe", the "Middle East", South America, all Asia which isn't Japan and sometimes India and Africa), I'll opt for instability.

[...]The police are part of our infrastructure .... we need them... [...]

Do we need them to kill (or injure) people? During most of my encounters with the police I felt rather felt threatend by them and not protected (did you ever feel how a Tonfa feels like when it hits your head? It's not nice ... and I was only sitting on the ground...

You don't even live in this country Brainless .... so could you keep your anti-British police rhetoric to yourself .... we really could do without it just now, thank you very much!

Yep, but I'm about to move to London for some months, even though "your" police is just as bad as ours. By the way, I'm rather anti-violence than anti-British police, no matter under which circumstances (though I respect the right to self-defence, which was not given in this case)...

Just a short explanation why I think I may criticize the British police just as much as the US police, german police and Irani police: Due to bi- and multilateral agreements, german law is somewhat near to british law and usually, the situation in Germany becomes similar to the situation in the UK and the USA a few years later. I don't want it to go into this direction so I raise my voice against it, both on national and international basis [oh, and to make things more complex: I object Nationalism as well...]. I suppose I'm right when I see this forum as an international forum.
You're free to criticize the german police, people, whatever as well. You're also free to criticize people who don't fit into your view on the world, just as I accept that there are people who think it's ok the way it is...

[steven 0]

I think that the Brazilian man should have followed the police's instructions and not run away. It would probably have been obvious to the police because when someone runs away from the police, they would have thought that the person is a criminal. Therefore, on the account of the British Police, I think that they had the right to shoot the man, because he did not follow instructions.But, I am against the police for shooting the man 5 TIMES IN THE HEAD! I think that 1 bullet in the head is enough to put a person to sleep, forever. Whatever happened, we need not to worry, because the Police and Tony Blair have sincerely apologized for the shooting. That's it from me.

[emperor 0]

Finally we know why the Brazilian guy has run away, as I've heard he had an expired visa. This is probably the reason why he's run when he has seen policemen. Anyway my opinion about the police doesn't change.

[whafizi 0]

Questions need to be ask. If you quickly came to conclusion after some tragedy happened, than probably you will be mistaken. As these attacks seems to be very concerning, everyone will be scared, and their mind are shut down by news and propaganda that been spread by the media. You see, we must use our mind, otherwise others will manipulate us. Here are questions that need to be answered;1. Why that man run away at the first place?2. Why the policeman quickly wanted to shot to kill. He was held down already at that time, then five shots was loaded to his head.3. Why quickly the policeman declare that the man was'nt one of the terroris? Is this because he is not from the middle east? Has the police made all the investigation needed? Has the police really know why at the first place that man run away?So ladies and gents, use your brain. Please think before coming to conclusion.One more question;Who is this Al-Qaeda is? Why they would kill the innocent? WHAT IS THEIR MISSION? You know, because of them, then several things unjusts are justified in this modern world;1. The attack of Afganistan2. The demolision of Iraq3. The prejudice feeling and hatered to all their community.So, do you really think that these are their attentions? Do you really think so? Then what's next?

[Milovoriel 0]

Let's hope you don't need the assistance of the British police when you're visiting London, Brainless .... or would it go against your principles to ask them for help? ....

[brainless 0]

I avoid members of police forces on duty as much as possible, among other things I tend to work trouble with other people out without police assistance...
... and no, it's not against my principles to ask other people with the equipment necessary to help me for help. If the next person with such equipment available happens to be a cop - who cares?

[...]Speaking at a press conference after a meeting with the Metropolitan police, Vivien Figueiredo, 22, said that the first reports of how her 27-year-old cousin had come to be killed in mistake for a suicide bomber on Friday at Stockwell tube station were wrong.

"He used a travel card," she said. "He had no bulky jacket, he was wearing a jeans jacket. But even if he was wearing a bulky jacket that wouldn't be an excuse to kill him."
[...]

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