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About The Trap17 Readme

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Dooga

Come on everyone, admit it. :P You know the Xisto readme is a hell of a complicated page to read. Every single link is a forum topic somewhere abandoned in the lost forums of Xisto, which is like a pile of sand, with 1 million words in each grain (the grains are also from the year 2004). Wouldn't it be easier to just rewrite everything into one page, and delete all the archaic out of date FAQs and Help topics? It would be easier if the Xisto Readme was actually a readme instead of 100 links to 100 different readmes... it certainly scares new members, methinks. It doesn't need to be a huge complicated list of rules or a multiparagraph essay explaining how the hosting credits system works. I think simply 200 words is enough to describe the hosting credits system, maybe even less. First off, Categories are very important. I think there needs to be 3 main categories on the Help Topic. 1.) Using the Xisto Forums2.) Understanding the Hosting Credits System3.) Guide to cPanel hostingI'm sure that you, like me, know that those 3 topics cover every single link and question inside the Xisto Readme :PActually, when I have the time I plan to make a one page Readme that will be extremely easy to use and read. Hopefully we can edit it together, and make Xisto a more 'organized' place.And of course, don't take any of my opinions personally, I'm sometimes a bit straight forward so the point gets through, I didn't mean to insult anyone who created the Xisto readme or any of the topics within.Alas, off we go to start a new Xisto cleaning adventure! I'm sure we've been through some of the worst ones together, some alone. But we can do it. :P


Plenoptic

A few weeks ago I had the idea to making a video of how to use the forums or something along those lines but didn't exactly know how to do it. I also heard though that there is a flash version of the Readme coming out? Not sure about that but I think I read it somewhere. I agree it probably scares some people and people probably don't click the links unless it is something specific you are looking for. If we are going to do this maybe we could post the ReadMe, and then people post edits that may need to be made and then have a vote or just have an admin approve?


Dooga

Actually there is already a flash version of some tutorials here: http://forums.xisto.com/no_longer_exists/

I also made a screencast a long time ago, but that was so long ago that Xisto had a different forum skin...

Also, I made a 1 huge page with all the readme stuff in the page and with categories, but I lost that somewhere.

That's why I thought it would be a good idea to make a new one :P

(coughcough lol the fact that the tutorials weren't very visible says something :P)


rvalkass

I think I need to update those Flash tutorials at some point, or possibly redesign them slightly to be a bit easier to understand, and cover more common topics.

 

Rewriting the readme into one page sounds like a good idea, as looking through the various topics the links point to is not exactly an easy task. A static page somewhere is a must, but a combination of Flash, screencasts, images and walkthroughs could also help explain many common tasks, and of course prevent as many of those repetitive topics appearing.

 

For example, you could have headings like Creating a MySQL Database and Setting Up Email Accounts and provide links to a text version, and any other versions of that information we create. Or, have the text version displayed, but also provide the links at the top, something like:

 

View this as Flash, screencast video, step-by-step walkthrough.

 

It would require quite a bit of work updating the existing material, and rewriting bits of it, but it could be gradually added to and would certianly help the majority of new users (and some of the more experienced ones) out there.


BuffaloHelp

Oh gee thanks... for bashing my Readme :PYes, we should restructure Readme page. But here are some reasons to consider before we re-vamp the whole thing---people (especially newbies) will still ask and post questions that are covered by however well covered topic. It's not the language, it's not the description...it's simply how human nature behaves. "If I don't get an answer in next 5 minutes, I'm just going to post and ask." See how many the same topics regarding where is my credit number and how can I get hosting credits topics and questions there are... this will never change-I made Readme to point to the topics which covers the list (which is presented in most FAQ form) so that they can reply to the relevant topic and earn hosting credits at the same time.-Readme is not the board rules (hence the hosting FAQ came first before forum FAQ). Readme is an organized collection of topics which were covered by board members that fits closely to the mostly asked questions. Otherwise, I would have named them FAQ or HELP files rather than Readme (Read Me).-Readme respects previous topics and should not re-create the wheel (so to speak). I rather not have a file in off-site since it will be cached by search engines. Our board core idea may not change but how our hosting and forum work may change. And I hate to have out-dated rulings and description floating around the web. You'll note that all HELP links are never (and should not be) cached? It's how OpaQue set the SEO for the board. So keep these in mind when you re-vamp Readme page. And as I said in the beginning of Xisto Readme project, if you find relevant article or topic that should be included in Xisto, all you had to do was send me a PM and I will consider it.Thanks! PS, rvalkass is in charge of flash tutorial. He should still have the login for annex.trap17.com for tutorial section. If you would like to work on flash tutorial as well, please contact rvalkass. And if rvalkass forgot his login information you can always contact me :PFor those who would like to work on different areas and would like to use annex.trap17.com for your project, please contact me via PM.Let's make Xisto part of 2008 best internet community!


Dooga

Actually I was thinking that the readme shouldn't be part of the forum. It should be separate, hence will have the ability to run its own scripts etc. What I mean is, readmes could have its own comment section or something similar. People, including noobies, hate reading rules and complicated topics filled with information. And as you said, they would post a topic about it. But if we made the readme very concise and easy to use, and on one easy to access page, it would save so much time. While I don't want to bring more hassle to OpaQue, the reality is that it is way easier to read something on a website, than a forum.Hey maybe I could use annex.trap17.com to cough up a Xisto readme. Perhaps you can give me a chance to try that out :PAnd don't worry, a simple meta tag should prevent caching.Personally I still think it's a grand disability to rely on the forums to provide information about getting hosting, even though it is the place where you would have to earn it. There has been countless amount of threads created that explains how hosting works, and it is extremely complicated and hard to find. I can remember over 3 different topics explaining the hosting credits... Don't worry I'll make a simple and easy to use Help File, let me try it :P


BuffaloHelp

Dooga,I'll send you a login for helpme section under Annex. Give it a go and let's see how it goes :PUPDATESent login information to Dooga.URL: annex.trap17.com/readmeIf I am not available, please work with jlhaslip since he has the full public_html access to annex. However, to create special login for project team should be notified by me. I wouldn't want the login information to annex to fall into the wrong hands. Xisto's FAQ was compromised few times in the past by sharing information without account's admin.It is NOT to say that I don't trust our team.. it is better to limit who has what access for the time being. Please forgive my poor language trying to express my security concern. Thanks.


Dooga

I apologize for this bump of the topic, but I have somewhat a suggestion that I'm uncertain about:Perhaps we could make a wiki readme? It would be separate from the forum, but it will be easier for moderators to edit, it will be up to date, and people can ask small questions in the discussion tab instead of bumping topics that is of grandpa age. :XD:


Plenoptic

I apologize for this bump of the topic, but I have somewhat a suggestion that I'm uncertain about:
Perhaps we could make a wiki readme? It would be separate from the forum, but it will be easier for moderators to edit, it will be up to date, and people can ask small questions in the discussion tab instead of bumping topics that is of grandpa age. :XD:


They will ask the questions despite the fact if they don't look first, that's usually why they post there in the first place. Of course I can't put it down without trying either because I'm usually wrong. :)

serverph

i had the same general idea several months ago, when there is evidence of a great influx of newbies in the forum all at the same time. i even started working on it (http://forums.xisto.com/no_longer_exists/) in my attempt to "organize" readme information found on Xisto forums (merging rampant redundant details), but never got to finish it due to recent personal circumstances. i have briefed buffalohelp of this (remember, BH? :)) but i never followed through with the plan. if you guys are still looking for a way to organize the readme, i suggest that which i used for RTFM (which i'll probably revamp with my own stuff later on -- seeing that it is littered with my google adsense code :D) -- that is KnowledgebasePublisher. perhaps it can be installed on t17's annex site? i find it easy to use with a straight-forward interface, and is much better off than a forum-based readme, i think. :XD:


jlhaslip

One thing which I have noticed about the readme, and its management, is that we seem to blur the line between Member and Hosted member.I am not being critical of the information inside the Readme file, or its method of presentation, but, rather, i would suggest that perhaps there should be a seperation of the information according to the member status (sort of)... or perhaps 2 separate Documents/methods...One for Forum members outlining the Rules of the Forum, Acceptable Use Policy, reasons for warnings and Bans, etc that relate to the use of the Forums and an explanation of how to stay out of trouble in the Forum, the plans for Hosting, the features available on the Forum, and the features they can look forward to on getting hosted.The second for the Hosted Members that explain the details of the Hosting accounts, the features and the use of them, the Terms of service and AUP, etc which apply only to Hosted members.Remove the "clutter" for a new member to wade through if they only want to know the Forum Rules. And branch off the Hosting Rules into its own document.As an example, when i first joined, I remember wondering what a "nameserver" was when all i wanted to do was to find out if "cussing" was allowed or not... :XD:As it exists right now, there is a whack of information in there which should only be used by Hosted Members, so I suggest the Readme be broken into two parts. The method of presentation (ie: serverph's idea) is a seperate issue from what I am proposing.